View Full Version : moving V10.5 Desktop only to V12


09-01-2013, 12:49 PM
I have a big Desktop-Only app I would like to move to V12. A brief test has uncovered no issues. Has anyone moved from 10 to 12, and discovered any issues?

09-01-2013, 03:28 PM
Hi Martin,

I understand v11 and 12 are virtually the same. I have moved many apps(some are **very large) to v11 with no problems at all. That is coming from v10.5 and very few changes from v10.

** I call large as over 50 tables/forms/reports and a lot of code.

I hope this helps you.

09-01-2013, 03:32 PM
thanks - mine is about 680 tables

Tables: 686
Sets: 127
Forms: 556
Browses: 31
Reports: 336
Letters: 0
Labels: 26
Scripts: 229
Appends: 212
Summaries: 104
Functions: 107

09-01-2013, 05:42 PM
I wish I could help you more on this, but I suggest it could be a matter of what code you may have used in scripts, functions and other. I would doubt uyou used anything that has changed from v10.5 to v11.
I do not have v12 at this point to test with.
Suggest you try opening a copy of the application with v12 and try all the tests you possibly can for compatibility. I am sure you are already doing that though.

Bob Whitaker
09-02-2013, 04:13 AM
Martin you should be ok with this but one word of warning - if you use Netmailer or Reportmailer they don't currently work with V12

09-02-2013, 10:11 AM
Thanks - so far so good - any word on when they are going to fix it so they will work?

Ted Giles
09-07-2013, 05:54 AM
Thanks - so far so good - any word on when they are going to fix it so they will work?
You are joking right?
I am still waiting for confirmation that V11 is officially stable, although Richard has said that he "thinks it is stable".

09-07-2013, 06:14 AM
Ted - you are behind the times - I have been using V11 for several years with some very big and complicated apps. V11 is rock solid!!

Bob Whitaker
09-07-2013, 06:42 AM
I am finding it very hard to get any sort of response from Alpha. Elsewhere in this forum others have indicated that the level of Alpha Customer Service has fallen way below what it used to be and is acceptable and am very sorry to say after many many years of excellent service this is painfully true. I bought the upgrade to V12 so we could continue with our application on Win 8 in early July and after a few exchanges of email, the first of which needless to say suggested it was my fault, there was a reluctant acceptance that neither Netmailer or Reportmailer would install with V1. We are now six or seven weeks down the line and again following a number of emails to customer service NONE OF WHICH WERE ANSWERED, I contacted Richard directly and some days later received an email saying it wasn't fixed and they could not indicate when it would be fixed. CAVEAT EMPTOR ( let the buyer beware )

Ted Giles
09-07-2013, 01:59 PM
Ted - you are behind the times - I have been using V11 for several years with some very big and complicated apps. V11 is rock solid!!
Well I checked today and there is still a health warning on using the latest patch.
It isn't as solid as it should be. See complaints from Alastair re the browse issues. He had his post part pulled and altered.

09-07-2013, 02:01 PM
I still use the last full download. afraid of the patches until the final comes out.

09-07-2013, 05:55 PM
Ted, I suspect people who are having issue with the browse have very limited experience in using embedded browses. I have 30 Hospitals in MD entering data in an embedded browse, with out issues; I have several more in IA doing the same; and I have many Hearing Aid dealers accross TX doing the same. - all using V11 more or less since its inception.

However, I will add this caveat - when I have a build that works for my software I DO NOT UPDATE ANY MORE PATCHES!

I am using build 2765 -3937 on win7 64 in most cases

09-07-2013, 06:04 PM
Amorris, I suspect that the last patch IS OUT. You can download earlier patches than what you currently have, if they work better than your current build.

09-08-2013, 02:25 AM
Martin, I have quite a number on a5 as well and using embedded browse for data input. I do keep it simple and limited. I probably would have no problem with the latest patch. I don't care to be a debugger anymore.

But thanks for the thought.

I am fully aware of how the patches work since I have been with alpha5 from v1-v11. That is a good part that you can go backwards.

Ted Giles
09-08-2013, 06:06 AM
I suspect people who are having issue with the browse have very limited experience in using embedded browses.
This might well be true Martin, but the complainant had a previous version working just fine and it fell over in V11. The fix was the latest patch, however there is still a health warning. It was a known problem, so I'm not sure you can lay all of the blame on the chap concerned.
Of course there are workarounds and things you can do (but shouldn't), and should do but don't.

Amorris, I suspect that the last patch IS OUT.

This pre-release build is not intended to be used in a production environment. is still on the download page. So how do you reconcile your statement? Richard hasn't confirmed that the patch is stable although he believes it is. I await his confirmation.

09-08-2013, 11:30 AM
Easy, Ted - don't use the patch. Use one that does work. Have you even tried V11 with one of your apps? with an earlier version?

Ted Giles
09-08-2013, 02:21 PM
I am not the one with the problem Martin. I have a few V11 apps running and I am also waiting for formal release of the latest version.

Alastair tried to convert an app, but the V11 current authorised version has a glitch in the browse when using a form from a previous version.
Alphas solution was A) pay for assistance , or B) use the latest patch. He chose B, but noticed that it hadn't been formally launched. So his problem is that if he puts the latest patch in, which he is told will solve his problem, it might compromise his installation elsewhere. He is or seems to be his own worse enemy however as repeated attempts to assist him - he is in the UK and quite close to me - has fallen on deaf ears.

Anyway, I'm sure that the DT as far as Alpha is concerned is a dead duck, but I live in hope that the final release will be soon, and then we can all get on either continuing to support V11 apps, or move on to something else. Funny that a lot of the competition has a desk top and web side though.

I have a feeling that the DT side is actually being dumped and there will be no more releases of fixes. See Bob's comment re DT in V12.

09-08-2013, 04:29 PM
Thanks Ted for putting that in.

One reason I was aggravated with the fellow that I think really needs help in design and was making so much noise about it, and then not letting anyone help him. I don't like, personally, that it is now open season for lambasting Alpha - I know there are likely some deserved gripes, but I don't think it helps us to run them down.

I know they are supporting V12 desktop, because very recently (maybe within the last week) Cian fixed an issue. Furthermore, about 10 days ago I submitted an issue I was having with V12, and within maybe 10 minutes I got emails from both Cian and Selwyn. It turned out that the issue was a bug in my code - but Selwyn suggested I look at email_send_mandrill() which I have now found a very useful tool.

I am not convinced they are going to "drop" the desktop. Although I am sure they currently have everything they've got thrown against getting the web to work with IIS as well as issues they are having with the web.

I've been using Alpha since 1998, and Customer Service HAS NEVER been a place to go for help. I got that message from other users way back then. I suspect that what is happening is that we are now used to getting good customer service from companines - like Cisco, MSN, etc. And the newer users expect to call and get good customer service. There are and have always been only two places you could go to get support - the Forum and sending a Bug Report.

Ted Giles
09-09-2013, 05:31 AM
So do you believe that IIS is still a possibility, Martin?
It's been a long time in development, and I am astonished that Alpha didn't simply stop all DT work in V11, and move on to V12 with a slimmed down and new Web based product without DT.
OK, two products, but they could concentrate on either one depending on the availability of staff.
At present, it seems that changes to V11 have to be replicated in V12 which seems to double up the work.

09-09-2013, 06:49 AM
Ted, I don't know, but the word on the street is they will.

Ted Giles
09-09-2013, 02:30 PM
I hope so. I have been using an IIS product on a trial basis earlier today and it was seamless. Just like the Alpha offering will be I'm sure.