View Full Version : Return of the granular crash-after p-mode


cathy benedict
09-27-2000, 11:58 AM
I have A4V6 running on NT Server with 5 user pack license
and 5 users. The Set is full of calculations and indices.
A Granular crash would occur when designing a set or DBF
on occasion so thanks to the helpful folks on this board we
installed the P-Mode Extender on the server. Our Set is on the server. It seems now we are having more crashes than ever. They are occurring on the memo screen. We can type the note fine, but when we hit F10 to save we get a granular crash. Sometimes I can go back into the program and the note is there. More recently the note is gone and it is happening more often. Today We couldn't alt-M to any record at all. I rebooted the server and it allowed us to post notes again. But now it is crashing again. re-install the DOS extender? Anyone else have this problem? Thanks, cathy

Samer N. Gorial
10-03-2000, 11:54 AM
I am having this problem when I go to print a browse table, same thing basically, it works fine untill I hit f10 and then the granular crash screen appears????

I have no clue what to do.... if you ever figure it out please let me know.

Samer N. Gorial


cathy benedict
10-03-2000, 12:17 PM
Mr. Gorial,

Thanks for the reply- I'm going to have the extender
removed from the winNT server to see if we have less of a problem. My thinking is if I want to reconfigure or
"program" something I'll do it on my own station-maybe I'll install p/mode there since thats where they say it works-on
single stations. I'll hope for the best on the server.

I'll let you know how I make out.


Samer N. Gorial
10-06-2000, 08:03 AM
for what ever this information is worth, I must tell you.... we overcame our granular crash "somewhat".

We were printing a browse table, while printing we would choose the primary index to be "time" and we would select "all deleted" records in the database

We exported the records that we wanted to print to a copy of the same database..... so we have a databse copy of the same data and fields with only the records that we want to print only this eliminates the need to choose (all deleted)
when printing from the browse table.

Printing then from th browse table we only printed by (time field) so that it would be less complex for alpha to print, and it printed fine with no granular crash until the end if we pressed F10... it doesnt always crash and sometimes we can just press escape before we press the last f10 to print.

I dont know if this helps you any, but I hope it does.

Good Luck!

Samer N. Gorial

cathy benedict
10-06-2000, 10:31 AM
Mr. Gorial-

We have to use f10 to save the notes on our memo page. I had the dos extender removed from the network server, however we had the crashes the same as before. I shut down the serever(not always convenient since we have 5 users in two different departments) but it does seem to clear it up for a while. There are probably work arounds to it- i have single line notes in another(child) database that we can use, but the memo page is so easy-its just too bad it doesnt work all the time. Im glad you found a way around your situation.

Thanks for the suggestion, though.

Samer N. Gorial
10-06-2000, 10:40 AM
???? thats very strange ????

I have never encountered anything like this. If I hear of anything or think of anything I will get back with you.

If I could ask though?, I understand it is a memo field, I wonder if you add another memo field to the record just to see if the same thing happens again with the second memop field in place.... or I would try copying the database and see if it still happens in a differently named database ?? if you have not already tried it.

With alpha I have found process of elimination has helped overcome most problems...

once again good luck...

russ Boehle
10-09-2000, 06:06 PM
My experience has been that granular crashes are due to problems with field rules but sometimes are hard to pinpoint. As far as the memo field is concerned you will find that over the long haul you will have better luck putting the memo field in a separate dbf with a linking field. To enter a memo have a script open the linked dbf, put in the link and play alt-m. The problem with memo fields is they are occasionally prone to corruption. If the memo is corrupt your dbf is out of commission until you fix it or create a new blank dbt. If the memo field becomes corrupt, you had better have a recent backup or you will in all likelihood lose all memos. By having the memos in a separate dbf you only have to restore the dbt file. I have no idea why you get the granular crashes on the memo field, but in any event the separate dbf will eliminate this possible cause of crashes. Also sometimes if you have complicated calculations in a field rule and are getting granular crashes you can replace some of the calculations with a field enter trigger script.


Samer N. Gorial
10-09-2000, 06:18 PM
Thank you so much, you are a world of help...

Samer N. Gorial

cathy benedict
10-10-2000, 06:48 AM
Russ & Samer,

Thank you both for your help. I'll try the individual memo .dbf. I'll let you know how I make out.

Again, thanks so much.


cathy benedict
10-10-2000, 02:49 PM

Well, I'm trying to take your advice, but now I'm
getting no more file handles. I've checked the server
-WINNTSystem32config.nt. Those files=25. I can' get
on the FAQ's screen where we were told how to set up NT.
Thats my server. I can't access my database and our computer people have gone home. I wonder if this has anything to do with removing p-mode?

Well-guess I'll wait til tomorrow. Thanks for the help.

Samer N. Gorial
10-10-2000, 03:06 PM

in my sys config it shows files=255

It may have something to do with PMODE ?

Mine seems to work fine with or with out PMODE....

I would be curious as to how you removed.... remember PMODE MANIPULATES SOME FILES IN ALPHA... so just removing the directory or file will do nothing I would assume?

But the only way I can think of to keep truly reverse what PMODE DOES is to reinstall the files PMODE originally changed ...


I think it is safe to say f you did nothing with these files.... PMODE was not "trul" removed....

Good luck....

Samer N. Gorial

Ronald Anusiewicz
10-10-2000, 04:58 PM

As I understand it, a granular crash is the result on the DOS extender developing a memory conflict. This is usually caused by but is not limited to errors in field rules, calculated fields, custom forms and who knows what else.

My experience has been thar P-Mode is more tolorent to these errors, but not immune.

If you are experiencing a granular crash, then you may have to redesign your form, field rules, scripts etc..

With regards to using Alpha 4 on a network, I believe the proper setup is to have the Alpha 4 executable program on each work station and to have only the data files on the server.

cathy benedict
10-11-2000, 06:09 AM
Ronald & Samer,

Thanks for your responses. Our network setup is
correct. The removal of p-mode was done by our
computer personnel so I'm assuming it was done correctly.

From what I read, p-mode was not tested on a network so
the effectiveness is questionable. Apparently the memo
field I have in my database should be in a separate

The granular crashes occurred both before and after installation of p-mode. So I'll probably have p-mode reinstalled and move the memo's to a child dbf. Wish me luck.

Thanks, again

russ Boehle
10-11-2000, 04:39 PM
We run A4v6.2 on a NT 4 network with about 10 to 12 users continuously pounding on it including memo fields directly in the dbf's. While putting the memo's in a separate dbf (Ira Perlows idea not mine) will help get you up faster in the event of a corrupt memo and can reduce data loss there is no reason why the memo fields won't run properly when part of the dbf. As Ron said its probably a field rule or something else strange. You might try copying the data in the dbf to a new identical dbf and add field rules one at a time until it begins crashing. This might help you find the problem. It is also possible that your dbt is already corrupt in which case you might as well go the separate dbf with a memo route to prevent future hassles.


cathy benedict
10-12-2000, 05:36 AM

Thanks. Trying to pin down the field rules will be a monumental task for me- there are many calculated fields-but I may try that if I can find the time. The separate memo dbf sounds like something I'm able to handle right now.

Thanks again for the much welcomed advice.