Slow Windows 10 Workstation Performance

[Finian Lennon]

We are having an issue as we replace old Windows 7 machines with Windows 10 machines. We run shadows on the workstations connected to a file server running 2012 R2. Typically We will have four or five sessions running concurrently.

We have a main menu that displays a browse with a list of open tickets. A double click on a line opens that ticket for editing. We display 5 images on the form (driver's license, customer picture, cash card image, signature and fingerprint) all of which are required for the ticket to be completed. We have many stored images in the categories above, each in their own sub-folder. We have relied on using filefind.get() to retrieve the images for display. The issue is that, the first time we try to open the form (in a day), it can take five minutes or more for the the images to be retrieved and the form to display. After the form has been opened once, subsequent attempts open and display the images in a couple of seconds. So, it appears that after the initial attempt to retrieve the images, they are then in the cache and can be quickly retrieved. If We don't display the images on the form, the form opens in a second or two on the first attempt.

I have tweaked some server settings in the hope of improving things. I have made sure the application folder/sub-folders are indexed and I have turned on Windows Search. I see no improvement from the workstation, and the server performance actually seems to be slower. This is a virtual (hyper-v) server being hosted on an older (8 - 9 years or more) physical server.

Before I start making big changes to the forms and workflow I was wondering if anyone else has encountered this sort of thing and if anyone had any suggestions on what else I could try.

Thank you

[Al Buchholz]

Got more specs on the server hardware and network structure?

[Finian Lennon]

Hi Al:

I's a virtual (Hyper-V) server configured as Xenon E5630 @2.53 GHz with 16Gigs RAM. I don't have access to the specs of the host machine right now but it is more than 5 years (10?) old with abundant memory and disk space. It's running Server 2012 R2. The network is running Active Directory and is administered by an outside consultant. The network cards and switches are all gigabyte and seem to be working OK. We've used the same setup for years. The workstations are a mix of virtual machines running Windows 7 and Windows 7 and Windows 10 desktops where we have scanners (ID, signature, fingerprint and document) attached. We have a bunch of IP cameras for different purposes. Here the server is only sharing files. The workstations are all shadowed via a mapped network drive.

This issue only occurs with the Windows 10 workstations. I have debugged the form opening so that I can see the "freeze" occurs during the first attempt to retrieve the image name(s) from their respective folders which I am doing with filefind.get() which has always returned the filename(s) very quickly. That no longer happens on the first attempt. Once the first attempt to retrieve the images completes, subsequent retrievals are pretty much instantaneous. To put things in perspective, the number of images in the image folders ranges from 20,000 up to 100,000+ per folder. But the number of images per folder has never been a problem before.

[Mike Wilson]

Hi Finian,
My system is image intense, handling the movement, re-sizing and display of thousands of images within routine work in the system. We use Terminal Server having moved from Windows Server 2008 R2 running as Hyper-V virtual machine on a Windows 10 base OS to Windows Server 2019 running our system IS as a virtual machine all running not shadowed with work stations using Win 7 and Win 10 machines. This last may be differences enough to not be comparable. But I'll give a shot at helping anyway.

A double click on a line opens that ticket for editing. We display 5 images on the form (driver's license, customer picture, cash card image, signature and fingerprint) all of which are required for the ticket to be completed.

Is this form based on a set or single table, and is the form displaying the images based off the same table as the browse or different table. What method are you using to display the images? What are the sizes of the images and what is the file type?

The image name(s) from their respective folders which I am doing with filefind.get()

Why? It is unclear why you are employing a filefind.get() search for acquiring a filename. The double click in the browse must acquire a key field value used in the image file name for use in the filefind.get(). You stated each of the 5 images are in separate folders. Does the concatenation of the image folder path + the key value not the image file name? Is filefind.get() needed to acquire more than one file possibility for the key value for the user to select? What happens with the image file name after the file name is acquired with filefind.get()?

[Ted Giles]

Not having the same TYPE of setup Finian, I can only report my findings with Win10 and Browses.
In one app - single user - launching the Browse which is a complex one with icon images displaying the status of the record takes more time than you think it woul.
In Win7, it was instantaneous.
I suspected it was something to do with the new W10 security, but got sidetracked as it is really only used in anger for 2 days a month.

Suggest you try a small test app on the same server and see what happens without a Browse.
Also, try the app locally on a W10 DT.

[Finian Lennon]

Hello Mike et al: (no pun intended) the form is based on a pretty simple set. The key lookup values are stored in the parent record. The images are displayed as bitmap controls so we need to fetch the file name(s) each time a record is to be displayed. We used to use Image Refence fields for the image information. They sort of worked when we were only displaying the driver's license image but when we started to add additional images on the form it became a nightmare. We switched to Bitmap controls and we opted to retrieve the filenames using filefind.get() rather than adding additional text fields to store the filenames. As long as we were using Windows 7, the return from filefind.get() was pretty much instantaneous (regardless of the number of files in the folder) and now, in Windows 10, it is not.

All of the image file names are constructed using key fields in the file name such as the ticket number+customer_id. Unfortunately we also appended the date and time to the file name so we can't just create an accurate file name based on the keys alone, that's where filefind.get() was so useful. The only remedy I can think of is to add those text fields we opted against before and update the table(s) with the file names. I'm hoping to keep any required design changes to a minimum.

[madtowng]

Hi Finian,
I know a lot of people resist using sql, but sql does a remarkably fast job of searching and processing.
I understand the pain of converting to sql from dbf, but they can co-exist.
As an example, I have a project that compiles and prints commission reports a month at a time.
This process used to take about an hour using dbf tables. Since I converted most of the processing
to sql, it now takes less than 10 minutes.

[Ted Giles]

I'm with Gregg on this.
DBF is fine for quite local stuff, but not so great on a larger Web type or distributed app.
SQL can effectively work anywhere, DT/Web/Intranet and it only needs to be learned once. So you can develop and deply locally or globally using the same Db kit.
I keep feet in both camps and use DBF and SQL, but not usually in the same app. ( It's an age thing.)

It's worth investing time and I think you will find it's not as complex or difficult as you might have thought.

[martinwcole]

do you guys have any idea how much time it would take to convert a l a r g e DBF system to SQL? it could take from months to a year!!! at least!!!

[Ted Giles]

You are correct Martin, and I do know. I rewrote in a different RAD toolkit in SQL on the Web.
It's one of those issues where you ask yourself "have I chosen the right horse?" Or that there was only one horse available.
Once committed with a large system, it's not easy to change in the middle - for many reasons.

Going forward with an SQL base for new stuff may be the answer, and living with the old DBF features in what is rapidly becoming a legacy DB style.

As an aside, I have had to resurrect an old Net Book running XP. Far faster than Win10 on my Laptop. Better connectivity to servers and PnP devices.

[madtowng]

I would think the time spent converting depends on a few things. Are you scrapping your current app ? How much of your dbf data is actively used on a regular basis ?
dbf tables do not perform as well as sql with logs of records. Let your creative side (not to be confused with artistic) get involved.
The first question should be what are you trying to accomplish. After that, consider options. Moving all your data to sql, then pulling a
much smaller subset from sql should improve performance.

[Ted Giles]

Don't get me started on SQL Logs!

[martinwcole]

Here are some specs for an app that manages a large metallurgical laboratory that I have been managing since 2003. While I agree that the web and web tools and several new language/platforms are the future, old timers like me don't want to go with the web; we just want to keep using a database system that works well and that we are fluent in.

Tables: 1044
Sets: 203
Forms: 797
Browses: 68
Reports: 485
Letters: 0
Labels: 28
Scripts: 346
Appends: 261
Summaries: 149
Functions: 158
including field rule scripts, form scripts, and button scripts - there are close to 2,000 extra scripts

[Ted Giles]

I know exactly what you mean. That is probably not worth contemplating as a project. If it ain't broke...., however, read on.

In 2014 I was asked to develop an application which would cover the SLA for a number of sites. Each site has different suppliers, some have lifts/elevators, some have special needs, and some have very strict contamination control and legally enforceable requirements.

The client needed to be able to monitor the many, many different suppliers work efficiency so as to ensure it was carried out on time and to the specification. This was done partly by self certification documents, but mostly by visual or swab inspection.

The results had to be recorded in one of 3 ways; using a laptop, desk computer or smart phone.

Having used DBF and Alpha to develop and sell apps since around 1994, I decided at that point to learn more about the web side of development. So I now have a foot in both camps.

A recent development is for local authorities and they want whole control, no web, all local data. So I am developing in Alpha and DBF - which as an "oldie" I can do quickly with not too many errors first time around.

However, I do know that on the horizon the request will come for key data to be available on a smart phone. Not the whole shebang, just key finance stuff which may be asked for during meetings. That's where one SQL table sits in the schema and is linked to a published instance on the web. See the Hybrid App approach in my signature.

Really easy to do. Examples available.

[johnkoh]

Hello,

How do you create the "Data Entry" forms When you using the SQL? Does Alpha-Form or xdialog work with "SQL" tables?