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Loading A5V11 very slow

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    Loading A5V11 very slow

    On this particular computer, loading the desktop took 45 seconds with V11. V10 was somewhat faster, maybe 30 seconds, and V7 took less than 10 seconds. This is without loading an app.

    Two questions. First, why is V11 so slow at loading the desktop? Second, what, if anything, can be done to speed up the loading time? Can it load, say, without the Web App and thereby save time? Are there any shortcuts to bringing up an app that would make the load time shorter? This is a situation where Alpha is brought up by the user only when needed for a quick data entry process but otherwise does not sit open on the desktop. Waiting almost one minute for this "quick hit" is problematic.

    Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

    Jeff

    #2
    Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

    I have noticed a huge difference in V11 load versus v8 load times. v11 takes much longer to load just the A5 shell. I too would like to know if there is a way to improve the load times.
    Andrew

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

      Jeff, I have the benefit af a SSD with V10.5 on it. The apps are on the traditional disks.
      A5 startup is about 3 seconds, app kick off in 2 seconds.
      Going through a Runtime, still just 5 seconds.
      With this setup, Windows 7 loads and is available in 20 seconds.
      See our Hybrid Option here;
      https://hybridapps.example-software.com/


      Apologies to anyone I haven't managed to upset yet.
      You are held in a queue and I will get to you soon.

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

        I have a large app opening in V11 on SCSSI drives in about 3.5 seconds. The shadow takes maybe 5

        Sounds like the app is being screened, as from a Virus program. Need to exempt Alpha.
        Cole Custom Programming - Terrell, Texas
        972 524 8714
        [email protected]

        ____________________
        "A young man who is not liberal has no heart, but an old man who is not conservative has no mind." GB Shaw

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          #5
          Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

          I did try shutting off anti-virus, but that had no effect. The SSD sounds impressive, and I will eventually want to go that way, but my concern about loading time is more for the client who will need this, and I can't predict how each workstation will perform. I wonder if there is something more fundamental that can be done with A5V11 itself. One of the things I tried was getting more recent patches, but surprisingly there has been no update since June, so I already had June. No difference.

          This has nothing to do with the loading of the app. I'm timing it with just bringing up Alpha without an app. That's where the problem lies. The app loading doesn't add much at all.

          Normally this loading time of Alpha wouldn't be too much of a concern because in almost all cases, the only delay is that first start-up at the beginning of the day. However, in this particular case, the app serves a purpose only once in a while, when the user needs to perform a certain type of task. It will take a minute just to arrive at the starting screen and this will be embarrassing not just for me but for the image of Alpha Five.

          Jeff

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

            but surprisingly there has been no update since June
            No, but there is a nice and expensive Report Server.

            Jeff, if this is a seldom used app feature, is it possible to slim it down to the bare essentials and plug it into an existing instance?
            You could always swap databases and swap back again while Alpha is still running.
            See our Hybrid Option here;
            https://hybridapps.example-software.com/


            Apologies to anyone I haven't managed to upset yet.
            You are held in a queue and I will get to you soon.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

              Originally posted by Ted Giles View Post
              No, but there is a nice and expensive Report Server.

              Jeff, if this is a seldom used app feature, is it possible to slim it down to the bare essentials and plug it into an existing instance?
              You could always swap databases and swap back again while Alpha is still running.
              Bear in mind that I'm not talking about the loading time for the app but rather for A5V11. There would be no existing instance of Alpha running since the normal state is not to have Alpha loaded but just used once in a while, when the app is needed.

              Thanks.

              Jeff

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                Normally this loading time of Alpha wouldn't be too much of a concern because in almost all cases, the only delay is that first start-up at the beginning of the day.
                I took it that Alpha was started every morning. Then you could swap Db's
                If it's an on demand job, then I have no solution.
                See our Hybrid Option here;
                https://hybridapps.example-software.com/


                Apologies to anyone I haven't managed to upset yet.
                You are held in a queue and I will get to you soon.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                  Originally posted by Ted Giles View Post
                  I took it that Alpha was started every morning. Then you could swap Db's
                  If it's an on demand job, then I have no solution.
                  It is an on-demand job.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                    Does it need to be V11? Can it be done in V9?
                    (Smaller footprint).
                    If you want to share the code, I can build you a V9 runtime I suspect. (famous last words...)
                    See our Hybrid Option here;
                    https://hybridapps.example-software.com/


                    Apologies to anyone I haven't managed to upset yet.
                    You are held in a queue and I will get to you soon.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                      Originally posted by Ted Giles View Post
                      Does it need to be V11? Can it be done in V9?
                      (Smaller footprint).
                      If you want to share the code, I can build you a V9 runtime I suspect. (famous last words...)
                      I tried V9. It doesn't seem much, if any, faster than V11.

                      The version that really works well is V7, which preceded the Windows Vista, 7, etc. platforms. Running in XP it performs very well. I have a client performing high-intensity order taking with several CSR's and V7 is the one I had to settle on. At first I tried to work with whatever was current at the time -- it might have been V9 or V10. It bombed completely. The order entry process came to a crawl and froze, and nothing I did to solve it worked. It was only by taking them back to V7 (where they were for the original app I re-wrote) that they have been performing steadily, efficiently, and flawlessly since (a couple years now). Even the original app that ran under V7, when I tried it with V8, 9, and 10, suffered from the same afflictions. I suspect that whatever code what added to make these version compatible with Vista, 7, etc. was not optimized well. Pity, since I would really like to be using the latest version of Alpha in all cases.

                      By using V7, the question you may have is how I'm ever going to run it on a Windows 7 computer. Well, this was originally going to be a major problem since I had spent a long time developing the new app under the V9 or V10 Alpha, only to discover when I placed it in the production environment it bombed. I tried altering the server, the workstations, and anything else I could think of to get it working properly. Nothing. I had to re-write this very detailed, complex app back into the V7 version, which I discovered was the solution. It wasn't pretty re-doing every screen, button, etc. So how was I going to assure they wouldn't always be stuck with Windows XP? Windows 7 to the rescue. The virtual XP mode that is built in to Windows 7 Pro works fabulously. You can basically have Windows 7 environment for everything else and Windows XP for running this Alpha application. The Alpha application is really the main part of their operation, but most of the newer computers are Windows 7-based and many don't have drivers for XP, meaning you can't get the newer computer of your choice and put XP on it without potential issues. Windows XP mode under Windows 7 (and undoubtedly Windows 8) is the solution to continuing to use A5V7.

                      With all this said, I may employ V7 for the app I currently have in V11. I just need to be sure that this client's environment will enable the running of XP mode (it's a Citrix Server, and I don't know too much about setting up under Citrix for the external users).

                      That's my long explanation to your brief comment. I hope you and others can benefit from my XP mode experience.

                      Jeff

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                        I've used Citrix Presentation Server as a client in XP mode.
                        Never had to set it up though.
                        See our Hybrid Option here;
                        https://hybridapps.example-software.com/


                        Apologies to anyone I haven't managed to upset yet.
                        You are held in a queue and I will get to you soon.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                          If you are running A5V11 on XP, the slow load is caused by the loading of .NET 4.0. We have done a lot of optimizing to delay loading some elements until needed, but the full start make take awhile, especially with a slower processor typically found on an XP machine. Start up in Windows 7 is typically within a second or 2 of the start time for A5V10

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                            And if dot.net 4 is running? Does v11 create another instance?
                            See our Hybrid Option here;
                            https://hybridapps.example-software.com/


                            Apologies to anyone I haven't managed to upset yet.
                            You are held in a queue and I will get to you soon.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Loading A5V11 very slow

                              Originally posted by JerryBrightbill View Post
                              If you are running A5V11 on XP, the slow load is caused by the loading of .NET 4.0. We have done a lot of optimizing to delay loading some elements until needed, but the full start make take awhile, especially with a slower processor typically found on an XP machine. Start up in Windows 7 is typically within a second or 2 of the start time for A5V10
                              So .NET is really the issue? Does it need to be loaded? I.e., does V11 only run, as a desktop only, if .NET is present?

                              Jeff

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