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Question on Server Set Up

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  • Tim Sutherland
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    One thing to consider with the Server 2016 versions is that they require the use of Active Directory. This is a little more complicated that just running it as a file server.

    Leave a comment:


  • cdibi
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    One last hiccup with the server. Which operating system is better and more user friendly between 2012R2 Foundation, 2012R2 Essentials or 2016 Essentials. I've read that the 2012R2 Essentials is easier than the other but seems like it may be limiting in some ways??? What about the newer 2016, is that just the easiest and best way to go?

    Sorry for all the questions here, but some of this is new to me. Thanks for all the help!

    Leave a comment:


  • DaveM
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    I use v12 for all my recent clients, but v11 works well too.
    by email or phone, you can ask for desktop only if that is all you need. Maybe save a few bucks

    Computers: I only buy gamer computers anymore. Fast and rarely have issues. LIke http://www.bestbuy.com/site/ibuypowe...?skuId=4575215 It also serves well when server software is installed (to a point)

    Leave a comment:


  • cdibi
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    What about Alpha Software. I need to call and upgrade from version 9. Should I be looking at version 11 or 12 if given an option and costs are similar? Is either one more stable in a windows 10 environment?

    Leave a comment:


  • Al Buchholz
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    Looks good to me..

    Leave a comment:


  • cdibi
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    Thanks for the help guys and also the conversation Al. I have built a server online with Dell and what some opinions of whether this is powerful enough for 6-10 users. There are a lot of options and I do not have a lot of knowledge on servers.

    Thanks,

    Chris

    Dell Server Configuration.jpg
    Attached Files
    Last edited by cdibi; 02-14-2017, 10:58 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • DaveM
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    I have 10 user on the thin client model and doing very well. Had to change the way of data entry a bit. server is 2012 and 64 gig memory, 2.1 ghz

    have 40 users one shadode system and also working well. server is 2008r plenty of memory and 3.2 ghz

    2 solid choices

    Leave a comment:


  • Al Buchholz
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    Chris

    So now you have 2 choices to try.

    I've tried both and have been more successful with the server based thin client model.

    Dave suggests the shadowed thicker client model. I've replaced those systems especially when clients are connected on a wireless or remote network. Sporadic network issues can cause corruption of data and indices.

    The shadowed thick model does improve performance over a non shadowed thick client - especially at startup.

    The thin client gives the best performance until you overload the server. Then you get more memory and a faster CPU on the server. Or start farming the server into servers.

    One client is currently running a Xeon 3.30 GHz processor with 64 GB of memory with 2012 Essentials (64 bit OS) and supports 12 users running Alpha and Approach ( I know really old) with most users scattered around the plant on wireless connections. All the index problems are gone and performance is great.

    They tried the server model with a desktop computer as the server and it was better than the shadowed model they were using a few years ago, but found that the real server was by far the best solution.

    I've become more convinced to use that model when another client replaced Alpha with a canned package in the 5 digit range that used RDP exclusively for their MSSQL based system. I had thought a MSSQL system would run fine in a thick client mode, but they didn't.

    Did I mention that application maintenance is easier on the thin client? It's all in one place.

    As I mentioned previously, the runtime document should be updated, but probably won't be.

    So like a lot of things there are various options from multiple sources. So choose wisely.

    Leave a comment:


  • DaveM
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    The most accepted way is to :
    server for data and runtime on each user computer and use shadowed table setup having your remote access by way of a user computer.

    Leave a comment:


  • Al Buchholz
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    Originally posted by cdibi View Post
    There are some conflicting thoughts above.

    The posted manual excerpt above says not to have everyone connect to the server using the runtime on the server. Some of you are saying to do that???
    Are you talking about this?

    Multi User If you are installing a multi user application, the installation involves multiple steps - installing the application files on a shared server, installing the Runtime files on each user’s machine and (optionally) installing a “bootstrap” application on each user’s machine (if your application uses Network Optimization). IMPORTANT You should install the Alpha Five Runtime on each user’s local machine. DO NOT INSTALL A SINGLE COPY OF THE RUNTIME ON A SERVER FOR USERS TO SHARE FROM THEIR DESKTOPS. Doing so could result in serious performance degradation.

    If so, it is correct in that you need to have an appropriate server to handle the load. (Also probably written awhile back.... before we discovered the RDP/TSPlus type advantage.)

    It is also why I don't recommend a faux server - ie a desktop machine as a standalone server. Never send a kid to do an adult's work.

    Originally posted by cdibi View Post
    Right now we have a desktop machine with 3-4 others in the same building sharing the data file but running alpha on their own machine. We are still on XP using V9 right now. I need to buy some new equipment and upgrade Alpha so I can do anything at this point. Just want to find the best way that runs the smoothest. We are having frequent freeze ups right now which is pushing me to change what we are doing.

    The other question is which version to upgrade to, 11 or 12?

    I appreciate all the input here as I do not do this for a profession, but do enjoy doing it.
    If you are only doing desktop, you can do either. Depends on what license you can get from Alpha if you haven't already purchased one.

    Leave a comment:


  • cdibi
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    There are some conflicting thoughts above.

    The posted manual excerpt above says not to have everyone connect to the server using the runtime on the server. Some of you are saying to do that??? Right now we have a desktop machine with 3-4 others in the same building sharing the data file but running alpha on their own machine. We are still on XP using V9 right now. I need to buy some new equipment and upgrade Alpha so I can do anything at this point. Just want to find the best way that runs the smoothest. We are having frequent freeze ups right now which is pushing me to change what we are doing.

    The other question is which version to upgrade to, 11 or 12?

    I appreciate all the input here as I do not do this for a profession, but do enjoy doing it.

    Leave a comment:


  • DaveM
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    BOTH above are very doable.
    running the whole app and runtime on the designated machine/server take a bit different and requires lots of memory when users are many
    Most of my installs for clients used a shadowed runtime which hardly ever fails and as Al said, have the remote client go through a user computr instead of direct to server.

    Leave a comment:


  • Al Buchholz
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    Originally posted by cdibi View Post
    I'm a little confused on the best way to set up can someone explain in laymen's terms.

    Our needs are fairly simple. We need to have 4-5 people accessing the database from within the building and one from outside the building. What is the best way to set this up? My thought was to put the data files on the server and then have each computer running the runtime desktop software accessing it?
    I'd suggest you have the data and runtime on one computer ( a server ) in the building and use RDP or TSPlus to connect the other computers to it.

    Setup each user on the windows server and have them connect to the server with their own username and password.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ronald Anusiewicz
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    I found the following in the manual that comes with the runtime application. You may want to go through the manual picking out what you need.
    The hardest part of getting alpha running across a network is setting up user permissions. The process is really quite simple.

    Multi User

    If you are installing a multi user application, the installation involves multiple steps– installing the application files on a shared server, installing the Runtime files on each user’s machine and (optionally) installing a “bootstrap” application on each user’s machine (if your application uses Network Optimization).
    IMPORTANT You should install the Alpha Five Runtime on each user’s local machine. DO NOT INSTALL A SINGLE COPY OF THE RUNTIME ON A SERVER FOR USERS TO SHARE FROM THEIR DESKTOPS. Doing so could result in serious performance degradation.
    IMPORTANT Each user must have read/write access to the folder on the server where the application files are installed.
    For multi user applications, you should consider taking advantage of Alpha Five’s Network Optimization feature. Applications that run on a network will run much more quickly if you use Network Optimization.
    Using Network Optimization
    If you want your application to use Network Optimization (recommended), then follow these steps:
    1. Install the application files on a shared folder on the server.
    2. Install the Runtime files on each user’s machine.
    Regarding the remote login, there are a number of ways to achieve this. The best way really has to do with the hardware you have to do the job.
    1. If you have a server with the appropriate resources, TSPlus may be your best option. (You need to research cost)
    2. If you have a spare computer already connected to the network, gotoMyPC may be a really good option. (Monthly fee)
    3. If you have a static IP address and a spare computer like number 2, Microsoft's built in RDP may be a good option. (Free)

    It all comes down to your available resources.
    Last edited by Ronald Anusiewicz; 02-03-2017, 10:36 AM. Reason: not sure what happened but my long response was omitted

    Leave a comment:


  • cdibi
    replied
    Re: Question on Server Set Up

    I'm a little confused on the best way to set up can someone explain in laymen's terms.

    Our needs are fairly simple. We need to have 4-5 people accessing the database from within the building and one from outside the building. What is the best way to set this up? My thought was to put the data files on the server and then have each computer running the runtime desktop software accessing it?

    Leave a comment:

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