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Upgrading Users Runtimes

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    Upgrading Users Runtimes

    Hi All,

    If i need to upgrade my clients with the latest Runtime builds you would expect that it should be simple to copy the new build over the top of the existing old version but if i do this when trying to run the engine it generates the error message.. see attached.

    It is OK if the latest build is a clean install to a new folder but this then requires that all existing shortcuts need to be edited and sometimes they may have several apps running from the same engine.

    Anyone else tried to upgrade their users Runtime builds?

    Michael

    #2
    Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

    Hi Michael,

    Why do you think you need to install the latest patch of a runtime, if your app is running perfectly smoothly?
    Regards
    Keith Hubert
    Alpha Guild Member
    London.
    KHDB Management Systems
    Skype = keith.hubert


    For your day-to-day Needs, you Need an Alpha Database!

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

      I'm assuming that the only time you should upgrade is based upon your current application build. The Run Time installed by should always reflect your current distribution build. Only update the runtimes when you distribute a new build is how I do it. Ryland

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

        Why do you think you need to install the latest patch of a runtime, if your app is running perfectly smoothly?
        __________________
        Regards
        Keith Hubert
        Because if the user loads a further applications developed in a later build I would prefer they only retain a single runtime engine for all apps.

        I am sure there must be a way of avoiding the errors when overwriting the Runtime files and this is why I have posted, hoping someone knows how.

        Michael

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

          ahh - ok I understand. I have only one main app that is integrated. Maybe someone else will have a suggestion.... Ryland

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

            Hi Michael,

            It is generally accepted that "if it aint broke, dont fix it".

            I realise why you asked the question, but as I understand it, you only need to update the runtime, if there was a bug in the full version of Alpha you were working with, on the application you developed and installed on a clients machine, which is something I'm sure you would not have done.
            Regards
            Keith Hubert
            Alpha Guild Member
            London.
            KHDB Management Systems
            Skype = keith.hubert


            For your day-to-day Needs, you Need an Alpha Database!

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

              Michael, your experience here may be more than mine, but I've always assumed one would either:

              a) uninstall, then reinstall (the runtime); or

              b) run the runtime patch against the existing installation.

              When you "copy the new build over the existing" are you actually running the installation program, or are you merely copying?

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                The user downloads an .exe and it runs via Astrum installer and ideally i want the users to always overwrite the Runtime without the need to ask the user to uninstall (They may inadvertantly uninstall the wrong app and loose their data). I can easily install giving them Runtime1 and Runtime2 folders so leaving existing applications and shortcuts in place but I would prefer to overwrite using a single up to date engine clean from past bugs for all of their applications and because in the future i may need to update applications with new features from the new browse etc ....this is why I am asking if anyone knows of way to overwrite.

                Surely there must be a method to overwrite the old runtime engines with later versions in the same way that we download from the Alpha site the latest builds and overwrite the existing engines.

                Michael
                Last edited by Michael Humby; 04-10-2009, 05:47 PM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                  What am I missing here? There is a runtime patch for every full version patch. What's the problem with just running the runtime patch on the runtime machines just like you do on the development machine? I do it all the time, with no problems whatsoever. The patch gets the runtime install folder from the registry (I assume) so you do not even have to worry about different machines having the runtime installed in different places.

                  On an entirely different subject, I am with you on reasons other than something being broken for wanting everyone on the same A5 version you have done your latest development and testing on. New patches not only fix things mentioned in the release notes, they often fix other things not mentioned, plus they add new features that you may have taken advantage of in the app's latest build. Keep in mind that if you run into problems with a new patch, it is a simple matter to just roll back by re-installing an older patch version.

                  Raymond Lyons

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                    Michael,

                    Does Astrum run the runtime patch exe you download from Alpha? Runtime patches overwrite all the old stuff as far as I know.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                      What am I missing here? There is a runtime patch for every full version patch. What's the problem with just running the runtime patch on the runtime machines just like you do on the development machine? I do it all the time, with no problems whatsoever. The patch gets the runtime install folder from the registry (I assume) so you do not even have to worry about different machines having the runtime installed in different places.
                      Can we do this? I don't think we can on client's PCs unless they have the full version of Alpha installed (and this is very unlikely).

                      I think my original post has become side tracked. All I want is the ability to distribute different applications to existing customers and overwrite their Runtime folder on their PCs with the latest build regardless of how many of my applications they own. In other words lots of different applications supplied over several years and a single up to date runtime engine. (I do not want their PCs cluttered with different builds of runtime)

                      They may have purchased an application two years previously developed in an old build and now I may be upgrading their existing application and also supplying another new application so it would be far more logical if they have a single runtime engine installed.

                      Presently, if I try to overwrite their runtime with a later build, the runtime will not run. I need to know if there is a way to overwrite existing runtime engines with a new build or is this just NOT possible because of Alpha licensing issues.

                      I am off to the golf course now.

                      Michael

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                        Just to confirm... you have multiple apps installed for 1 client all using the same runtime folder on 1 PC. I didn't get that from your original post. So... all your apps MUST be at the same runtime level.

                        Anything to do with Vista? From the info I read in the runtime builder in Alpha5, the location for the runtime folder is under \Program Files. If you're running Vista with UAC On this could be the problem. I've not installed a couple of apps on one PC yet but it's not hard to test, but I can't do it under Vista with UAC ON.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                          Michael,
                          Just tell your clients to point their browsers at
                          http://downloads.alphasoftware.com/A...chDownload.ASP

                          and they can download and run the patch. They don't need the full version to do so.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                            Peter,

                            Thanks for your advice, i am amazed that a non full version user can do this.

                            Unfortunately, this will not meet my needs for various reasons and also i have introduced the Alpha branding utility into my runtime installs.

                            Ideally, i would like my custom install routines and downloads from my website to simply copy the new runtime build over the old files.

                            Do you think this is possible by perhaps by omitting to overwrite specific key files?

                            Michael
                            Last edited by Michael Humby; 04-12-2009, 05:36 AM.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Upgrading Users Runtimes

                              Originally posted by Michael Humby View Post
                              Peter,

                              Thanks for your advice, i am amazed that a non full version user can do this.

                              Unfortunately, this will not meet my needs for various reasons and also i have introduced the Alpha branding utility into my runtime installs.

                              Ideally, i would like my custom install routines and downloads from my website to simply copy the new runtime build over the old files.

                              Do you think this is possible by perhaps by omitting to overwrite specific key files?

                              Michael
                              Are you saying you are trying to fully hide "Alpha Five" within you application? If so, that is not fully possible (or at least practical) no matter what you do, as some error messages and other minor things will still reveal Alpha Five being under the hood. Plus all the A5 patches say is that it is an Alpha Five V9 patch--hardly a big deal, I would think, though I suspect you disagree. You can even rename the patch file something like "My App Patch.exe" and put it on your web site or send it out on your CD. These runtime patches do exactly what you want in all other regards with no worries about messing things up, other than the possibility you may occasionally have to roll back to previous patch if the latest patch runs into a problem that your testing did not reveal. That too is a no brainer. You should never have to re-install all the runtime files the way you seem to want to do. All you are doing is asking for trouble. That said, I suppose there would be a way to do what you want, but I for one would not wastre a minute trying figure it out and test it. It's the old cost vs. benefit thing and to me there is virtually NO benefit.

                              You could also try to get Alpha to put out a version of the patches that do not say anything about Alpha Five--probably easy enough to do but given the underwhelming demand for such a thing, I doubt that they would do it. But you could put it on the Wish List on this forum and see what happens.

                              Raymond Lyons

                              Comment

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