Strange Behavior with a form

[forskare]

I have a form based on a set. Evertime I open it, it's in data entry mode and will not allow me to view other records by using the previous or next arrow icons.

The forms properties are the default values; no restrictions. There are records in the table.

What gives?

Thanks,

kenn

[Jim Chapman]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Hi Ken,

What's it like in Minnesota tonight? We're having a major storm, shoot, I just planted the Palm trees yesterday.

First thing I'd do is check and see what index or query is active. Second thing is go to the default form and see if the same subset of records is showing there also. Got to think it's the index, query, or form. Did you rebuilt indexes? And of course the famous database compact.

Good luck,
Jim

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Ken, could you post a sample that illustrates the problem?

[Mike Konoff]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Also, if you press "esc", are you asked, "Are you sure you want to lose your changes?"

I would guess that if you are asked that then you are sure that your form is in "enter" mode. If not, maybe it's something else, such as a corrupt form.

(Hey Ken, your an invenstigator right? Heck, you should be able to spot a corrupt form a mile away!!!!)

Mike

[forskare]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Good Morning Jim, Tom, Mike, et al. When I posted last night I guess I was more tired than I thought. Best excuse I have next to being tired is that Access treats sets a bit differently than A5 does and keeping the mindset separte is a task at times. I've been reading the manual about sets, indexes, forms, etc., but I'm still not out of the woods. I did select the linking field as the primary index for each table.

1)When a set is created, the set is essentially one big table, right?

2)So, if I want to enter a new record for a child table only, I have to create a form or browse based only on the child table, so that the linking field data automatically xfers over, right?

3) There must be a way to do this w/o writing xbasic. Using the button genie, "show records only where" doesn't doesn't xfer the linking field data.

I've read & re-read the manual but I'm missing the part that deals with this. (There could be a chapter devoted to Browses, Forms & sets; how they interact with each other, when to use an embedded browse or a browse based on a table.)

I've got some other thoughts but that would make this too lengthy.

Thanks for the insight.

Jim, I picked fresh oranges this morning from the backyard. Been sunny and 40's here.
Mike, Yah, you're right. But even the best investigator gets bogged down in the thick of things.

kenn

[Michael Humby]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Ken,

If you try the default form for the set, in order to navigate the parent, a parent field must have focus unless you place a button that specifically refers to the browse containing the one to many records.

Michael

[Mike Konoff]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Kenn,

You should be enter child records directly into the child table through the embedded browse that you placed on the data entry form for the set, such as how I enter Invoice or Purchase Order line items, unless I've missed something you're trying to accomplish.

On your form in your embedded browse, if there are no related child records, then there should one shaded row with in the first column...click on that, , and you'll put the child embedded browse into "enter" mode. Enter your info, press F9 to save, and F6 to exit the browse. Or, press ctrl-E to enter another record in the embedded browse.

I believe that there are ways to enter into a child of a set by using a form for the child, but I would also guess that doing it that way is more complicated than entering directly into the embedded browse, maybe requiring xbasic.

Does it seem that I've misunderstood what you're trying to accomplish???

Let me know.
Mike

[forskare]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Mike,

You're on the right track. On my first app, I used a tabbed subform and did what you're suggesting. However, several on this board have cautioned against using a browse for data entry so that's the direction I am exploring. Sometimes though, a browse is just the ticket as well as a combination of form and browse is used; example, a data entry form is used which contains a browse of only 1-3 fields. The browse is for the purpose of being able to have a snapshot of the records already entered which is useful for needing to know the last record.

That seems to be my preference, at least at this point. The problem is there is no way to use the form for data entry w/o using xbasic to automatically enter the data into the linking field. This has been discussed to some extent in past threads so I'll revisit. The drawback to an embedded browse for data entry is the # of fields needed. If there are many fields, scrolling side to side is not the coolest way of doing it.

In this instance, A5 is it's own worst enemy in that the more powerful a program is, the more simplistic and thorough the manual needs to be. I won't go down that road as A5 folks know the problem there and I know they will do all they can to make the v5 manual simplistic and thorough.

Need to try a couple of things and then report back. Thanks for the advice.

kenn

[Mike Konoff]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Kenn,

I've not had any problems entering data into a browse, nor have I heard of any problems entering data with a browse.

In version 4.03 I experienced an occassional rub whereby when I "changed" the value of a numeric field the numbers would not be accepted into the field as I type them. Someone suggested that I was fat-fingering the "change". But, I thought I was doing that for a while until I finally caught on to what was happening. On occassion, the program would not take the data as I entered it. I'd change the value from one number to say 45.95. I'd enter 4-5-.-9-5. The value might be 5.495. The first number would be delayed and out of sequence. (No lie...I'm not drunk...burp.)

However, this problem does not exist for me in version 4.50.

I have heard that there are problems with using memo fields though. Ira suggested, I believe, to put memo's in another table, related 1-1 to the table the memo is for. He might be able to shed some light on what your involved in.

Thanks,
Mike

[Jim Chapman]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Hi Ken,

1)There is a couple of ways to do this, one way would be to create a set using the current parent as the parent of the new set and the child table you want to enter a new record into (or edit an existing record) as the child, but define the link as a one to one. Now you can display the child fields on a form.

2) On your existing form put the child table as a one to many browse, but only show a field or two for identification puposes. Now add the child's fields outside of the browse on the form. As an example of how this would look check out the invoice app that ships with A5 and open up the customer base form. This is not a set, but as you scroll through the browse the form is also cycled.

3) Really isn't difficult with a little xbasic. Try this to make an edit form that will open up when you press a buton. First create a form for the child table. Now go to the set form where you will begin the process. Go into design mode and add a button to the form. Say 'Built in Action'. Now select 'Form/Browse Operation, 'Open a Form', select your child form from the list. The next screen will ask you which records you want the form to show. Tell the genie 'Show only records where' then direct the genie to show only records where the linking field is equal to the parent linking field. Now save.

Now you have a working button, but pressing the button will open the form with the first child record that links to the parent. Not what you want, but you understand what is going on and the button genie has written all the code to this point. Now go back to design mode and right click the button and choose actions. You should see the inline xbasic. You need to modify the query.filter expression. You can do it in the in line xbasic screen or convert to xbasic. Replace the query.filter expression with this:

"recno() =" + alltrim(str(recno("NameOfChildTable")))

That should do it. Now pressing the button will bring up the child form showing whatever child record was current on the set form. Similar for entering a new record. Just put the linking field value in a variable, open up the child form and a line or two of xbasic to put the value in the child's linking field.

Good luck
Jim

[forskare]

RE: Strange Behavior with a form

Mike,

Thanks for the info. I hope the memo field issues are straightened out in v5 although many have not had any problems at all.

Jim,

#2 is what I had in mind althought I couldn't understand why it should work as I thought that adding a new record for teh child table would cause a new record for the set to be added. Not the case. I created a tabbed subform (Oh how I love tabbed subforms!) Then I created an embedded browse based on the child table rather than the set and added a few fields from the child table to the other part of the tab. Works like a million bucks.

I also added a form to another tab, based on a child table rather than the set. I chose link to new form but ran into a problem in that the form I created was saved but weird stuff happened. The tabbed subform moved to the top of my screen and the message, cannot load form but using default form instead appeared. However, no form was used. I exited went back to the tab added the existing form I had just created. Multiple record additions worked just fine.

Now which chapter of the manual should I write about this? B4 you say Chapter 13, there ought to be a meeting of the minds (now that's a loose term) to throw out all sorts of scenarios of the various ways this has been done. Gotta give that some thought? I wonder if Cal is putting something together?

Well, back to my form design.

Thanks for helping me through this obstacle. "I can see clearly now, the rain (snow) has gone......"

kenn