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Thread: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

  1. #1
    Member
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    Sam Gerber
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    Default "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    I've been having trouble with form calculations that are very straightforward and should work so far as I can see. (They calculate incorrect values.) Also, just scrolling a read-only embedded browse changes calculated field totals. Poltergeist?

    I fear that Version 11 is not fully cooked and I'd like to drop back to a previous version. I don't know yet what version has a good reputation for being stable, but for the sake of this inquiry let's say it's version 10.5.

    1. How can I get the 10.5 download?

    2. Do I uninstall/reinstall, or install on top of V11?

    3. Will I have any activation problems?

    Thanks in advance for any answers. I'm a bit desperate.

    ... Sam (Gerber)

  2. #2
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    Allen Klimeck
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    This will back you up to an older version of A5V11.

    Goto this link:

    http://downloads.alphasoftware.com/a...nate/index.htm

    Pick the one you want and install it.
    Last edited by Allen Klimeck; 09-08-2012 at 05:13 PM.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Alan I appreciate your quick reply. I was hoping to stay away from Version 11. I have a sense that Version 10.5 might have been a good release but I'll have to ask around a bit.

    I looked at the page you cited and when I saw that there were 8 updates in one month and 11 updates in another month, well ... ... ... anyway I'll continue to investigate the availability of a Version 8 thru 10.

    I upgraded from Version 1 because I couldn't live with 16 bit code any longer. Any stable version that's 32 bit will suit my needs fully, if available of course.

    Perhaps someone will see this thread and offer me a download provided my license will activate with it. Does anyone reading this know whether activation is a problem going backwards?

    Thanks again Alan ... Sam

  4. #4
    "Certified" Alphaholic Keith Hubert's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Sam,

    Going backwards is not the best of ideas. It might solve a current issue now, but all it is doing is saving another one for a later day.
    Regards
    Keith Hubert
    Alpha Guild Member
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    KHDB Management Systems
    Skype = keith.hubert


    For your day-to-day Needs, you Need an Alpha Database!

  5. #5
    "Certified" Alphaholic
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Sam,

    Vers 10 is a separate product, There is no downgrade option, so far as I know. I don't even think vers 10 or 10.5 is even available for purchase these days.

  6. #6
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    Martin W. Cole
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    I am almost certain Tom is correct. If you already own 10, and you want to buy additional seats, I think you can do that, but otherwise, not.
    Cole Custom Programming - Terrell, Texas
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    ____________________
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Hi Keith. I've spent 12 hours or more on a single problem where I just can't get something basic working. One of the Alphaholics is going to look at my DB and see where the problem is.

    If it's because of something subtle I missed and yet is within the spec to work that way, I'll bite the bullet and keep V11. If on the other hand it's a bug, I'm making every concerted effort to swap it for something between V8 and V10.

    Hope that seems fair to you.

    BTW, can you name for me the most stable version of Alpha from 8 through 10? In your opinion and within your experience, of course.

    A private message would be good, considering all things.

    I respect your opinion Keith but I'm a teeny bit rankled right now at all the time lost. I'd like it to be my fault for missing something obvious.

    Regards ... Sam
    Last edited by sgerber; 09-09-2012 at 12:24 AM.

  8. #8
    "Certified" Alphaholic Keith Hubert's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Hi Sam,
    I've spent 12 hours or more on a single problem where I just can't get something basic working.
    That does not make V11 unstable.

    You have not indicated here what the "something basic" is. Unfortunately you are coming to V11 in one great jump without climbing the ladder and appreciating all the changes along the way. Thinking that by going back to what is now, a product removed from production, will make life any easier for you, I think is a mistake.

    I get the feeling you are coming to V11 with your past experience of V1 and expecting it to work the same way. It took me a while to get to understand the difference between a database and a table. Try and forget what you know and learn how to get things done with Action Scripting.
    Regards
    Keith Hubert
    Alpha Guild Member
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    KHDB Management Systems
    Skype = keith.hubert


    For your day-to-day Needs, you Need an Alpha Database!

  9. #9
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Sam,
    I agree with Keith - even if you could go back to the first 32 bit, which I think was alpha 5, version 4.0, you would still have the same basic issues learning to program in a new style. It took me several months and a great deal of frustration learning new approaches.
    Cole Custom Programming - Terrell, Texas
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    martin_w_cole@msn.com

    ____________________
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  10. #10
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Keith and Martin, I didn't say A11 WAS unstable. I'm frustrated having spent a large chunk of time trying to make something work that won't work. What I said was that I feared it might be unstable and was considering dropping back a version.

    I'm returning to Alpha Five development after many years away. I know it's changed a lot over the years and that it's not the same product. I bought Version 3 in 1997 and read through the books and yes it had already changed then, BIG TIME. On the other hand, some things still haven't changed. The expressions back then work today as does the user GUI interface.

    The form I'm working on is a set with 4 tables, 7 form calculated fields, 2 embedded browses. All of these items seemed to me to be nearly identical to 15 years ago. The calculations are totally identical and they're not working. Clearly they should work. I recognize the possibilities for something else being amiss. Perhaps a checkbox here and there that didn't exist back then.

    A member of the Alphaholic community has volunteered to help me on this. I'll be sending him my newly created test DB with details of the problems. I'm sure he'll help me get to the bottom of this.

    Clearly (to me) what makes Alpha Five possibly the best relational product on the market is the Community support it has among all you faithfuls. The time you donate to helping newbies as well as established peer developers is something I've never seen before with any other product.

    I just hope that you're not too upset with me. This too shall pass.

    Thanks to all of you reading this who have supported me in my threads and for the thousands of other threads that you've made available.

    Best to all ... Sam

  11. #11
    "Certified" Alphaholic Keith Hubert's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Sam,

    Old Chinese proverb. Many hands (heads) make light work. This I found to be true, when the electric fuse blew.

    Instead of only one developer looking at your application, post it here and many more of us can have a go at it.
    Regards
    Keith Hubert
    Alpha Guild Member
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    KHDB Management Systems
    Skype = keith.hubert


    For your day-to-day Needs, you Need an Alpha Database!

  12. #12
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Thank you for your offer Keith. Right now I'd be stepping on his toes if he doesn't have first crack at it. If it gets too dicey, I will then create a thread to seek help and will supply my new test database. I'm somewhat proud of that (if it works) since I pared down 180MB to <3MB.

    Later on this ... Sam

  13. #13
    Volunteer Moderator Peter.Greulich's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    I have to agree with Keith & Martin. Going back is not a panacea. V10 is a great product. v11 is even better. Personally, if it were up to me, Alpha would still be in the business of selling older versions. But I understand why they don't - they're not supported and no new bug fixes are available. v11 like all versions has bugs, but basically it is a fully functional product. Calculations work. Of course, it may be possible that you really have some odd bug specifically affecting what you are trying to do. But more likely, as Keith suggests, you are trying a v1 approach to a v11 product. And it is also likely that the v11 approach for what you are trying to do would be the same in v5 forward, although not knowing your specific problem(s), I can't say definitively. But chances are that v10 would have the same issue as v11. Take a deep breath, steady as she goes. I'm sure your problem can be solved one way or the other.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    We'll see what happens Peter when the form gets working. I know I'll feel terrible if it turns out to be a V11 bug. Peter, you don't have to defend what Alpha did with Version 11 but 11 fix releases in the same month has to be a world record and then 8 more in another nearby month! Clearly, to me, the product never should have been released. Beta testing should be done by internal staff, not by paying customers (unless the version was offered up as a "Beta"). What a world of pain!

  15. #15
    Volunteer Moderator Peter.Greulich's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Quote Originally Posted by sgerber View Post
    We'll see what happens Peter when the form gets working. I know I'll feel terrible if it turns out to be a V11 bug. Peter, you don't have to defend what Alpha did with Version 11 but 11 fix releases in the same month has to be a world record and then 8 more in another nearby month! Clearly, to me, the product never should have been released. Beta testing should be done by internal staff, not by paying customers (unless the version was offered up as a "Beta"). What a world of pain!
    Sam,

    Well, you don't need to feel bad if it is a bug or not. But sure, there are a million patches. Two points though: 1) you may note the patches include tons of new features, not merely bug fixes, and 2) most of is web related, because in truth that's where Alpha is putting their efforts.

    I don't disagree that "Beta testing should be done by internal staff, not by paying customers", but we are where we are, so we don't have a lot of choice if we wish to stick to the product.

    Here's a suggestion, Sam: instead of banging your head against the wall for 12-hours when you hit a brick wall, take an hour or two to build a small working sample and post it with instructions on how to reproduce the problem. I bet you'll get lots of takers w. advice and suggestions and if it is a bug, you'll get work-arounds.

    On that matter, in the past, I have seen some people who post their db after having the same kind of frustrations as you (I'm talking v10 and previous). They (understandably) complain bitterly how Alpha doesn't work and is not ready for prime-time, etc. Usually, when you look at their db, one can see the source of their problems is the result of bad approach(s) and limited understanding of how to make A5 work properly. Ideally it would be bullet-proof from the get-go, but it is what it is, and that ain't too shabby. Really!

  16. #16
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Here's a suggestion, Sam: instead of banging your head against the wall for 12-hours when you hit a brick wall, take an hour or two to build a small working sample and post it with instructions on how to reproduce the problem. I bet you'll get lots of takers w. advice and suggestions and if it is a bug, you'll get work-arounds.
    Peter, I'm somewhat independent and take some pride in my own skills. I try to avoid a public persona of being needy. I don't want people to think that I'm seeking the easy way out and trying to get others to do my work for me. That's why I stick with a problem longer than I should. Also, it's MY problem and it seems like I'm imposing to make it yours.

    You've made me feel quite welcome to seek help from the community and I will do that when I start spinning my wheels. Thank you for that.

    --- Sam

  17. #17
    "Certified" Alphaholic Keith Hubert's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Regressing" to an earlier Version of Alpha Five

    Sam,

    Another reason not to spend a long time trying to find a solution when learning a new program, which V11 is compared to V1 and posting a sample here, is that not only do you not get as frustrated for so long, but others following who do a search learn too.

    Two great thngs I have leanered from this forum, a prblem shared is a problem halved and what comes around goes around.
    I'm somewhat independent and take some pride in my own skills
    We all have that and by asking for assistance does not diminish your indepence. With regard to pride, we all have that too. However, I was once reminded that pride is like a top hat, the more we stand on it the more it gets crushed.

    I notice that Peter has over 9000 posts on this forum, I'm sure they are not all from giving answers to fellow Alpha deveopers.

    The unwritten ethos of this forum is to share and learn, I strongly hold to that and appreciate all the help I have received since joining. What I'm saying is, dont wait till your wheels spin.
    Regards
    Keith Hubert
    Alpha Guild Member
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    KHDB Management Systems
    Skype = keith.hubert


    For your day-to-day Needs, you Need an Alpha Database!

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