Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

[Ronald Anusiewicz]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

V10 will not run on Windows 8

I have V10 running on Windows 8. Under compatibility mode, select Windows 7.

[martinwcole]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

Is that a static setting - or do you have to select it everytime
How did you install V10? the same way?

[Ronald Anusiewicz]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

I don't remember how I installed the runtime files as this was last year. My personal preference is to install the runtime in a folder similar to : C:\A5V10RT\

Then right click on the desktop shortcut, properties, compatibility, check the box, Run this program in compatibility mode for: Win 7

[DaveM]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

You can copy a running v10 install off a win7 machine including the shortcut onto a win8 machine, export and import the registry settings and the files needed by alpha and it will run. You should not even need to run the runtime installer. If you decide to, the runtime installer does work in win8.
Yes, win7 compatibility.

[forskare]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

Thought I'd check for any news on desktop updates, etc, not really expecting any. My expectations were accurate, nothing new. Thinking back over the last 20 years, Alpha has never supported a prior version once a new version was out. They still sold it but with the new version out, why buy old when new will do? Even though Alpha still sells v11, they are not supporting it. For the most part, the same is true for the desktop, no matter which version is purchased, V11, AA1.0 or AA2.0. How do I know this? I'm simply looking at Alpha's past performance and their performance with the desktop in AA is following the same path.

Peter mentioned Alpha's existing customer base. Alpha doesn't really care about the folks who use the desktop only. Two reasons: 1) In an artical dated the end of last March, Richard referenced world wide customers numbering in the "tens of thousands". If it is assumed most of those bought AA, it was probably more for the web than desktop. 2) Alpha has not offered any desktop user a way to migrate to the web. Using the web components as a desktop is doable but only if a desktop form is used to open the app and then go to the tabbed UI, Grid or a UX component.

Obviously, I do not know Alpha's reasons for limping along with the DT. However, there is a way to convert the current DT users to true WCD if Alpha would allow for a WCD to be opened in the same or similar way as a desktop app. Call it WCD (or whatever) and a subscription only for that. Give DT users a reason to start converting apps to WCD beginning with a low, low cost, maybe even free. After all, is not the DT customer base worth keeping?

I also agree with Peter that the number of DT users has diminished. Yes, the DT is solid but it's riding off into the sunset like the cowboys of old. Many have or will leave simply because Alpha has not encouraged them to stay and with the handwriting on the wall, ....... Well, you get the picture. I'd like nothing better than for Alpha to tell me I'm wrong in this assessment. However, Alpha's track record speaks for itself.

[GGandhi]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

after all being said about desktop and alpha's decision not to develop any new desktop features or even supporting the current dwindling desktop developers, I like to say few words in support of alpha. ( I am not on their payroll, nor a professional developer, nor developed anything meaningful in desktop ).

> wherever you go you see people glued onto their mobile devices and a lot of functions that took place in the traditional desktop computer either doing functions locally or over the internet is being done via mobile devices. not to pay attention to that and market your product for that segment will even be more foolish than leaving the support for the dwindling desktop developers.

> all the operating systems now aim to connect all the computers ( desktop is being viewed only as a device ) and mobile devices into one large connected device family. look at windows 8 when you buy a new computer and sign in with Microsoft account all the devices share everything, same will be true come this fall with Yosemite from apple. so it quite possible the features that were possible on a desktop (standalone) may not be possible since the operating system wants to synchronize with mobile devices or the technology may be defunct to develop for the desktop version of their software. I do not know.

> like many things in life there is going to be change from something to another version of the same,

like for example LP records. I love analog music from lp, but to buy a turntable and a lp, it costs an arm and a leg and have to tighten the belt.
how about tube tv, gone. sure you might love that tv.
how about your car, not the same way it was built, how about water meter or gas meter reading. they just drive by and collect data. no one has to come to your house and knock on your door.
If you look around you can name many things to me that you were fond of, but gone or very dear to get. so is desktop. I am sure there is a place for it in future. but what if that desktop is only a sitting down version of the mobile device, you need to be ready for that.

I would think if you have to decide you will decide what alpha has done, correct?

[forskare]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

I am not against Alpha's move towards web and mobile. It is a must if they are to stay in business. In fact, I am all for it. My point is that there are quite a number of "desktop only" users. All I am saying is that they appear to be left out in the cold. Anyone who stays with the present DT, will go by the wayside along with the desktop unless Alpha makes some changes in their policies. That is neither right or wrong, simply a fact of life. At some point, the DT, as it is now, will be old technology, just as A4 is old technology. I suspect the desktop of the future will be web based in that it has to run on a browser, There is nothing wrong with that. However, it des not need to have the capabilities of connecting to mobile devices and other web features.

Alpha wants to sell the App Server as well and has a separate price on it. I suspect that Alpha doesn't want any web functions to work without their App Serve and therein lies the problem. In the mean time, some have left for other venues. Eventually all DT users will leave; there is no choice. OTH, developing the DT further or selling it is not really a viable option unless one wants to continue with old technology. That's why I said before AA was first relased. that Alpha would move away from the DT in favor of Web/Mobile. The question is: "Can/Will Alpha create a DT only version"? Of course it's never as simple as just doing it. There are many factors which come into play which I do not know.

[GGandhi]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

I suspect that Alpha doesn't want any web functions to work without their App Serve and therein lies the problem

it is not that they don't want, they have to, just like php and asp they need their interpreters to convert to html javascript codes for the browser to understand.
on the other hand

and has a separate price on it

I agree, they should give it for free and not version specific even if the decide to sell, they should sell for fraction of the price they sell.
now as it stands, if you want alpha and web you need to buy alpha web server for each version you want to support ( the same true for desktop, you have to buy runtime for each version ) not good if you ask me on that.

[GGandhi]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore

can this be said regarding web side?

[MoGrace]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

>wherever you go you see people glued onto their mobile devices and a lot of functions that took place in the traditional desktop computer either doing functions locally or over the internet is being done via mobile devices. not to pay attention to that and market your product for that segment will even be more foolish than leaving the support for the dwindling desktop developers.

'A lot of functions' - like what? Texting, playing games, Facebook and email. Which of those markets is an Alpha mobile app going to take over? Let alone make a dent in what those users use their phones for. I don't see it as a serious market to pursue either.

Now if you could develop apps like FedEx and UPS use, maybe there would be some real money in that. My Paychex rep used a hotspot with her laptop to access a live demo of their online payroll - that was impressive.

[forskare]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

can this be said regarding web side?

Most certainly. Tha's what gave me the words. The exploring is almost limitless.

[GGandhi]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

'A lot of functions' - like what? Texting, playing games, Facebook and email. Which of those markets is an Alpha mobile app going to take over? Let alone make a dent in what those users use their phones for. I don't see it as a serious market to pursue either.

Now if you could develop apps like FedEx and UPS use, maybe there would be some real money in that. My Paychex rep used a hotspot with her laptop to access a live demo of their online payroll - that was impressive.

you haven't been to apple store lately, have you? they ring you up via a phone, most of the people pay their bills via a phone, most word processor documents are available on mobile device can be edited and updated on the cloud storage.
if somebody can develop fedex app or ups app or chase or Citibank why you think you cannot? is there a limitation, you see?

you don't have to develop a new software you can just make your own desktop application available on these platforms.
you can tell your customer your application is available on desktop, web and mobile. any flavor they like.
how does that sound?
I would say, impressive!

[kkfin]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

Meanwhile in Redmont.

Microsoft gradually removing support for WPF, Windows Forms and Silverlight.

Office for iPad/iPhone launched already. Office for Android coming soon.

Microsoft .Net Foundation with Xamarin so .Net developers can use c# to build apps for Android/IOS (or other).

Cloud first then mobile. Message is clear.

Microsoft is reinventing itself.

[DaveM]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

I do my banking on internet for the most part by desktop to the web, but it is there if I wish to use a phone. That is just one small part.

As Giovani has mentioned. There are already many apps for use by phone and more coming. Some will rely on a website to store final data, some won't. Some will only be usable with connection, some won't. Sign an invoice on an IPhone="yea". It is all there to be puzzled together.

I said this before and saying it again. Future desktop apps will really be web apps installed on a computer or lan. It is, has been and will be happening more and more only because some people/businesses are hesitant to place their data on the internet.

[forskare]

Re: Do I want to continue using Alpha for desktop only applications?

Nearly all of those folks who we see fiddling with their mobile device and not running business apps. Any serious mobile app user is using it in the course of their work. What we see are folks who are texting, reading email, tweeting, etc. Business apps are another issue. Small business is not in need of mobile at this time, although the day is coming. A prime example is my customer with a desktop app. They don't need mobile and It's even dough making a case for web. They are very happy with an old A4 app but are moving to v11 simply because of the need for 2-4 people to use the system at the same time. Add the subscription costs and they are in no mood to spend over $1k a year for updates, bug fixes, etc. Alpha's constant sales gimmics only makes things worse. Simply put, it gives the appearance of instalbility. Will they stay with Alpha, move to another vendor or.... I wish I knew.