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Network Optimize default path

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    Network Optimize default path

    I would assume that when manually network optimizing, the default paths that A5 offers should be a safe bet to use, right? Not being exactly sure, I browsed the drive for the private path to make sure the networked source files were not going to be overwritten. Well, that didn't work. Two of the 4 machines I attempted to optimize overwrote the source files (I restored source after each failure). I have no idea how or why, but I have backups so the fix was painless. I've shyed away from optimize for a long time now because this happened once before when I did not have a backup. Could it be that the only reliable way to optimize is with a script, like Dr. Wayne has offered previously here? Is this a bug that might be addressed in v5?

    Tom Lyon

    #2
    RE: Network Optimize default path

    Tom,

    For me the key to successfully navigating these dangerous shoals is to pay very close attention to where I am before beginning the optimize procedure.

    I've never had a problem once I remember that I need to start Alpha Five on the local workstation, and then open the database on the server directly, being very, very careful not to use shortcuts to local shadow copies.

    It's also possible to use the file/folder browser available inside the optimize sequence itself to verify the 'save to' destination before committing the optimized copy of the database to disk. However, I've found this confusing at times. My preference is to accept the default save to destination in each case, once I've successfully remembered to open the 'real' database on the server, instead of shadow copies residing on the local workstation.

    Nevertheless, it's a process which always makes me nervous, and is not to be undertaken unless one is stone cold sober.

    -- tom

    Comment


      #3
      RE: Network Optimize default path

      OK guys, you've got me confused. How is it possible to overwrite the original data with the Network Optimize command?

      I've seen this issue brought up before so it can obviously be done 'accidentally'. I'd like to know how so I can make sure my customers don't do it - or explain it if they do.

      If I open the main data, the default is to install the network optimized version under the A5 private directory (often the same as the program/runtime) in a directory called shadow/xxxx. Unless I manually change the destination to the main data directory, it won't overwrite the original data.

      If I open an optimized version, I can't run a new optimize but only a refresh optimize which will simply overwrite the current optimized version - with no opportunity to change either the source or destination directory.

      What am I missing here?

      Comment


        #4
        RE: Network Optimize default path

        Tom (Lyon),

        Could it be that the only reliable way to optimize is with a script, like Dr. Wayne has offered previously here?

        I believe that's my code and Cal's you are referring to in the Code section, not Peter Wayne's.

        Everyone,

        I believe the cause for this is the user opens his Alpha 5 in a way that the user directory is the same as the database directory. I believe it is stored in the user's Windows registry, so it is hard to change by code. In any case, this is a really bad thing unless operating as a single user. Just see if there are any MUF files or other temporary files left in the database directory, and that would be a good indicator.

        I've added in my code right after the adb_shadow_path=shadow_path+chr(92)+adbfolder line the following, as an extra precaution to watch for this potential error.

        adb_path=IF(:a5.get_master_path()=="",:A5.Get_Path(),:a5.get_master_path())

        If UPPER(adb_shadow_path)==UPPER(adb_path)
        ui_msg_box("Incorrect Shadow Path","Database Path and Shadow Path both are equal to "+chr(34)+UPPER(adb_path)+chr(34)+CHR(10)+chr(13)+"Please change your private directory on this system and then restart",UI_OK+UI_ATTENTION_SYMBOL)
        END
        End If


        Regards,

        Ira J. Perlow
        Computer Systems Design & Associates
        [email protected]
        Regards,

        Ira J. Perlow
        Computer Systems Design


        CSDA A5 Products
        New - Free CSDA DiagInfo - v1.39, 30 Apr 2013
        CSDA Barcode Functions

        CSDA Code Utility
        CSDA Screen Capture


        Comment


          #5
          RE: Network Optimize default path

          Oops..I stand corrected on that :)

          Comment


            #6
            RE: Network Optimize default path

            Ira,

            Could you expand your comments on:

            I believe the cause for this is the user opens his Alpha 5 in a way that the user directory is the same as the database directory. - What could make this happen?

            Just see if there are any MUF files or other temporary files left in the database directory, and that would be a good indicator. Are you referring to the shadow directory or the original network location?

            Thanks,

            Stan
            There can be only one.

            Comment


              #7
              RE: Network Optimize default path

              Cal,

              You're right. I'd forgotten that when you open the shadow copy of the database network optimize is disabled. Had remembered that as being a feature of the runtime engine. Memory playing tricks on me.

              -- tom

              Comment


                #8
                RE: Network Optimize default path

                Stan,

                I believe the cause for this is the user opens his Alpha 5 in a way that the user directory is the same as the database directory. What could make this happen?

                One way might be this. You initially install A5 on, say, the server (which you use as a user machine too-very bad idea), you create a database in a default location which happens to be A5 directory which is also the private directory and the shared directory. There might be other ways to do it too.

                Are you referring to the shadow directory or the original network location?

                I said the database directory, not the shadow directory. This means the real database!!!

                Regards,

                Ira J. Perlow
                Computer Systems Design & Associates
                [email protected]
                Regards,

                Ira J. Perlow
                Computer Systems Design


                CSDA A5 Products
                New - Free CSDA DiagInfo - v1.39, 30 Apr 2013
                CSDA Barcode Functions

                CSDA Code Utility
                CSDA Screen Capture


                Comment


                  #9
                  RE: Network Optimize default path

                  "You initially install A5 on, say, the server (which you use as a user machine too-very bad idea), you create a database in a default location which happens to be A5 directory which is also the private directory and the shared directory."

                  But even if you do this, the default for the network optimize is still the "\Shadow\xxxx" directory. So, unless the user changes the destination manually, how can you overwrite the original data? Is it possible that some people aren't really losing their original data but only think so because they've mixed up their directories?

                  I'm don't mean to be obtuse or argumentative but I haven't figured out any way to accidentally overwrite the original data without manually changing the destination directory during a full optimize. (OK, I guess you could put the original data in the "\Shadow\xxxx" directory but I'd like to think nobody is crazy enough to do that.)

                  The only other thing I can think of is that someone would forget and manually copy the "data" files from the shadow directory to the original data directory. This would definitely destroy the original data! (Hmmm, maybe there is a good reason for keeping backups!?)

                  Comment


                    #10
                    RE: Network Optimize default path

                    Cal,

                    But even if you do this, the default for the network optimize is still the "\Shadow\xxxx" directory. So, unless the user changes the destination manually, how can you overwrite the original data? Is it possible that some people aren't really losing their original data but only think so because they've mixed up their directories?

                    Always a possibility.

                    I'm don't mean to be obtuse or argumentative but I haven't figured out any way to accidentally overwrite the original data without manually changing the destination directory during a full optimize. (OK, I guess you could put the original data in the "\Shadow\xxxx" directory but I'd like to think nobody is crazy enough to do that.)

                    What if they are running optimized, and try to do things like changing field rules, forms, etc? These would obviously be lost upon any refresh. Is it possible to add new tables to an optimized database? Perhaps they are doing this and that is why things get lost. I think that the most likely case is that the database designer did some maintenance on the database while optimized. I bet this messes with the default directories and can cause these problems.

                    Why is it some people always seem to run into trouble and other don't? I don't. You say you haven't. Is there a common thread here?

                    Regards,

                    Ira J. Perlow
                    Computer Systems Design & Associates
                    [email protected]
                    Regards,

                    Ira J. Perlow
                    Computer Systems Design


                    CSDA A5 Products
                    New - Free CSDA DiagInfo - v1.39, 30 Apr 2013
                    CSDA Barcode Functions

                    CSDA Code Utility
                    CSDA Screen Capture


                    Comment


                      #11
                      RE: Network Optimize default path

                      Ira,

                      I think my pc can detect, intuitively, when an inexperienced person is at the controls. Much like a horse can detect when an inexperienced rider is in the saddle.

                      Seriously, perhaps you don't have trouble because you already know how things work. Without even being consciously aware of it you may be avoiding problems that optimize newbies encounter simply because you have more experience.

                      -- tom

                      Comment


                        #12
                        RE: Network Optimize default path

                        Why is it some people always seem to run into trouble and others don't?

                        When I find customers having problems, all too often I find it's just a matter of "Wow, I would never have thought about doing it that way!" Sometimes people do it the 'right' way because of training, sometimes experience, and sometimes just dumb luck.

                        That's why I was asking the question.
                        (1) I can't figure out how to do it but maybe that's just because I just never thought to try a certain method.
                        (2) I want to avoid problems for both me and my customers.

                        Hopefully some of the comments and questions in this string will help others to avoid overwriting their real data.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          RE: Network Optimize default path

                          At the bare minimum, if when optimizining a database, a user points to the location of the actual database as the shadow location, the actual tables will be overwritten with the table pointers that an optimization creates. Bob Newhart once had a skit about an infinate number of monkeys in a room with an infinate number of typewriters, eventually producing some famous quotes. If something is possible, it will happen. In my mind Alpha should not allow the location of the shadow directory to be the same as the actual database when optimizing. This doesn't mean that somone moving files outside Alpha can't mess things up, but at least the process within Alpha is not so potentially dangerous.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            RE: Network Optimize default path

                            John,

                            Yes, I agree. That would definitely reduce my anxiety when I walk a customer through the process over the phone.

                            The other improvement I'd like has to do with the default destination folder name. At present (if I'm remembering this right), the default destination folder name for the shadow tables is the name of the current database. This folder is 'pathed' using the private folder, then shadow, then the destination folder name.

                            In my case I have two databases residing in a single folder on the server. This is because certain tables are used in more than one database. The default destination folder names lead to two separate shadow folders on the client workstation when I network optimize both databases.

                            In order for my design to work, both sets of shadow tables need to be in the same folder on the local workstation.

                            Things would be easier for me if the folder name on the server was used to create a default destination folder name on the workstation, instead of the current database name.

                            -- tom

                            Comment


                              #15
                              RE: Network Optimize default path

                              Cal,

                              Is it possible that some people aren't really losing their original data but only think so because they've mixed up their directories?

                              A year or so ago, I did it, i.e overwrite the actual data - twice in a month no less!

                              Unfortunately, in my panic, I did not take the time to understand what made it be so. But, it was not the private directory issue that Ira referred too.

                              Peter
                              Peter
                              AlphaBase Solutions, LLC

                              [email protected]
                              https://www.alphabasesolutions.com


                              Comment

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