Any dll workarounds?

[JerryBrightbill]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Bill
The app was just an example showing how your method can work. It was tested in A5V4 not V4.5 (budget restrictions at the moment). From your post, your field rules should allow you to do what you are trying to do. Since it apparently doesn't, there may be other issues other than the lookup. A simple test would be to open the app I posted and open the single form and see if the lookup for the single field works. If it does, then the problem may be somewhere other than V4.5. A couple things to check which may /or may not help.

Try the lookup from the default form. Does it work?

Is the field length format on the form the same as in the table definition? I have seen some strange behavior when it is set less than the defined field length.

Are there actions attached to the field events on the form or any events in field rules?

Have you changes computers or video cards? There are seem to some issues with some cards.

Don't know if any of these ideas help, but they are a place to start. If all else fails, you could post a copy of the app with just the offending table and some sample data and let the users on the forum take a look at it. Someone can usually find any problems.

Jerry

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Bill, maybe it's time to post the offending database so that others can see if it behaves the same way on their equipment. -- tom

[Eric Johnson]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Bill-

I've read all of the messages on this topic. I admit to not understanding the question initially and trying to figure out why you wanted folks to modify a simply list. I've just managed to piece it back together. It seems you don't want people to modify the list but rather you want them to be able to select from a list a text entry that is close to the desired end result and then to complete the entry from the keyboard....or to enter something not included in the list.

I have Version 4.5. While I still don't myself see the reason for doing this, I have it working without the system errors you reported....and which I assume are your real cause for concern.

You'll need to identify the exact error message for anyone to help you. You also might look for these files (Start|Find|File Finder). MFC40.DLL should be in Windows/system at a minimum though it may also be in the same folder as Alpha 5 Version4.5. SH31W32.DLL should be in the same folder as Alpha5 Version4.5. If you do find the files, you might note the file size and dates. My guess is that your problem is either missing or munged files rather than a bug in Version 4.5.

Eric Johnson

[CALocklin]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

I think I know what's happening now - I just remembered that I have a similar issue with an application I use at home for tracking stocks. About once or twice a year I try to put too much text in a field that has a simple lookup list and is set to 'allow any'. I found out that the program crashes any time I put more than about 60 characters in the field.

For me it was such a minor issue that I just re-start and do it again with an abbreviated comment. In one case I needed the extra text so badly that I removed the field rule temporarily, typed the text, and restored the field rule.

I don't recall any DLL error messages but I will try it this weekend.

Anyway, if your problem is similar to mine, a work-around might be to reduce the length of your field. This may mean using some abbreviations but that should be better than crashing the system.

[Peter.Greulich]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Bill,

I agree with Eric. It is not an A5 bug. I do what you want to do on lots of forms with no problems whatsoever.

Peter

[Bill]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Eric,
To you, and anyone else following this thread, I get the sense that I am trying to do something here that is completely idiotic. While that may be true, it makes perfect sense to me. The simple lookup (if I understand its' purpose correctly) offers the user a choice of frequently used entries, or the option to add to/or change those entries as needed. A table lookup (again, if I understand correctly) only allows the user to choose what is in the table, or (if they need to modify a choice) save that modification to the table, in order to use it. 60% of the time, the given choices are fine as they are, but 40% of the time, something else is needed that would, I guess, make it a unique entry. A table full of unique entries decimates the useful features of any kind of lookup, ie; the ability to quickly find what you want in the commonly used entries. That is issue #1. Issue #2, despite the fact that what I am doing may border on lunacy, there is clearly a problem when it used to work fine (in v3.0) and now does not. I've read responses that indicate there are dlls in one program that may not be in the other, or that I should check the sizes & dates between them, or they don't like each other and refuse to play with each other without fighting. BOTTOM LINE: I DON'T CARE WHICH COMPANY STARTED THE PROBLEM, I DON'T CARE ABOUT THEORY, I DON'T UNDERSTAND ANY OF IT, I JUST WANT IT TO GO AWAY. What I need is for someone to write; "take the sh31w32.dll from winME's directory out behind your house, pour gas on it, and light it. After you've settled up with the fire department, return to your computer and copy the same dll from A5 into winME directory" or something to that effect. Explicit (does this guy even know a computer requires electricity) kind of answers. Despite sounding pissy, I do very much appreciate everyone's attempts to help, and I thank all of you.

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Bill, how about zipping your database and posting it here with a short text file explaining exactly how to trigger the error? If the error does not happen here, we can furnish detailed descriptions of our setup. If the error does occur here, perhaps we can see a simpler solution for you.

-- tom

[whanigsberg]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Bill J.,

I think you have it backwards. A simple lookup set up in field rules presents the user which a list which has been created in the field rule editor. This list *cannot* be modified by the user.

The table lookup can be (by choosing the proper option or options in field rules) be modified by the user. That is, the user may modify existing records in the lookup table and/or add new ones.

The third way is "previous values" which is obviously user modifiable.

Bill H.

[CALocklin]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

OK all you nay-sayers and doubters out there. Attached is an example file called LU_TEST. Open it and ADD text to the field with a simple lookup definition until the field is filled (total 70 characters). It WILL crash A5 on my Win98 system every time. The crash seems to occur somewhere between 60 and 65 characters but is not consistent. If you use a lookup that is over 60 characters and nothing else is added, sometimes it crashes and sometimes it doesn't. If you simply fill the field with random text (i.e., don't use the lookup), it will still crash somewhere in that 60-65 character range.

This crash will occur in v4.03/build 230 and in v4.5 build 263 and 266 (coming out soon) but it does not occur in v3.40.

Bill is not crazy and he's not doing something wrong.

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Cal, I'll check it here. I don't recall that filling the field completely was mentioned anywhere else in this thread. Maybe I missed it. -- tom

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Cal,

Your database behaves as you describe. It crashes Alpha Five on my system, too.

To try to help Bill, I had already built my own little model, and it works fine. Does *not* crash like yours.

When I compare the two databases I see that you have the simple list lookup field in the first position of each record. In my case, it happens to be in the third position. i.e. the third field in each record. On a hunch I inserted a new field ahead of your simple list lookup field. Guess what, Alpha Five stopped crashing.

If the problem can be solved on your end the same way, I suggest you forward the details of this little oddity to Selwyn Rabins, directly. I know he'll be interested in it. If Bill is listening in, maybe he could try to solve his problem the same way. Just change the structure of the table to move the simple list lookup field to some position other than first field in the table.

Hope this long shot hits the mark.

Let me know what you find.

-- tom

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: Any dll workarounds?

Cal, my first guess proved wrong in further testing.

The significant difference between my database which does not crash and your database that does crash, is the field width of the simple list lookup field.

Mine is set to 50 and yours is set to 70.

change yours to 50 and the crashes will stop.

-- tom

[Bill]

THANK YOU, THERE IS A GOD!!!

I'm so happy others are starting to see this. I may even put off using my computer for punting drills. Bill H. mentioned that I have it backwards in regards to how each type of lookup is intended to be used. I have tried using both simple & table lookups in my app, but unless I'm missing something (and that is a very distinct possibility!), any modifications to a table lookup must be made by saving the modification to the table lookup. As I mentioned to someone previously, this completely does not meet my needs. The modifications I make to the lookup choices are done on a situational/specific (to that record) basis. In many cases this amounts to a unique entry in that field. I don't use the previous values field rule for the same reason. If I have to have several thousand choices in the lookup, I may as well just type in each entry from scratch. One of the fields in question is part of an embedded browse. This browse is the child table, whose purpose is to keep a running history of attempts (by the user) to contact the client (parent record) to schedule an appointment for a physical exam for their life insurance application. It is, in essence, a progress report about individual clients and a way of tracking where things stand at any given moment. Because of this, there are many possibilities. Most are standard and typically occur, but there are frequent instances where the choice needs to be added to, and sometimes with lengthy detail. At any rate, this field functioned perfectly until I upgraded to v4.5 Thanks again, Bill

[martinwcole]

RE: Any dll workarounds?


to further compliment Tom's message, I have also noted that it is best to never put any kind of lookup field in either the first or last position of a form - it tends to either not work, work errantly, or crash the program.

[Tom Cone Jr]

RE: THANK YOU, THERE IS A GOD!!!

Bill, I've concluded that the problem occurs when using the simple list field lookup with a field that is 'wider' than 50 characters or so.

Until this is fixed, you might investigate using the speed typing field rule to expedite data entry. This is a 'transformation' rule. Basically, you build a glossary and abbreviations which, when typed, cause Alpha Five to substtitute the full text. Might be a decent interim solution to your situation.

-- tom