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Erratic behavior of A5

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    Erratic behavior of A5

    I've previously posted something about the erratic browse behavioyr of A5, and unfortunately the problem still persists.

    Basically, I can never tell when Im going to be flipped out of the record I'm working on into its neighbor.

    I select a letter from an A-z multi-state button. All records starting with the right letter are displayed in a browse.

    Then I click on the record I want to edit, and the fun begins.

    Sometimes, it stubbornly refuses to display the record at all.

    At other times, it displays OK, then as I start to edit, flips back a record. And won't let me edit the record I want to.

    And sometimes it works fine.

    Please can someone suggest what's happening?

    #2
    RE: Erratic behavior of A5

    "Please can someone suggest what's happening?"

    Not unless you post a sample of your application.

    Bill
    Bill Hanigsberg

    Comment


      #3
      RE: Erratic behavior of A5

      Database herewith. Most of the data has been removed, but the problem is pretty repeatable:

      * Open the Master Form;

      * Click on any last name in the browse list;

      * Make a change or two to the main text entry field ("Body", FIELD8);

      Save and repeat.

      You may have to do this a few times before the problem manifests. But once it does, you can't get rid of it - have to quit and restart A5.

      Thank you.

      Comment


        #4
        RE: Erratic behavior of A5

        Fixing the Tab order helps a little, but without digging too deep, my experience has been that a single form (with multiple browses, tabed pages etc) and working with multiple 3rd level sets simply will not fly. I would simpify the master set and open some seperate forms from the main form instead - passing variables(s) that 'link' the data between tables.

        Regards,
        Scott

        Comment


          #5
          RE: Erratic behavior of A5

          Thanks, Scott.

          "open some seperate forms from the main form instead..."

          You mean opening new windows? That's tough, because I wanted to access all this data on one screen...

          Comment


            #6
            RE: Erratic behavior of A5

            Yep -open new windows. Your intent may be good for the end user but I don't see how it could be done in A5 with that set structure and have the app operate in a stable manner - but maybe wait for others to comment as I am no pro.

            Regards,
            Scott

            Comment


              #7
              RE: Erratic behavior of A5

              OK, but it's a bit galling to think that A5 can't cope with this... I've got used to thinking of it as a Swiss Army Knife of databases... yet I seem to have run smack up against a serious limitation...

              Comment


                #8
                RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                Peter,

                I took a look. I don't know what is happening and there are more potential candidates than I have time to investigate at this moment.

                I don't know why you use a 50 character field (company)as a linking field in master.

                Regardless of the cause--which I think you could eliminate ig you invested enough time--I agree with Scott. And I do not find your objection well-taken as your user cannot see everything at once on your master form without switching tabs. But if they are clicking on a tab they can just as well click on a button to display a smaller, clearer form bases on a simpler, lighter, quicker set.

                Peter Wayne has an article on simplifying your application which you should read.

                Bill
                Bill Hanigsberg

                Comment


                  #9
                  RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                  Thank you for looking at this, Bill.

                  Actually, the tabs could be dispensed with: all the necessary info is presented on tab one, "Main". Are you suggesting that killing the other five tabs might help?

                  Peter

                  Comment


                    #10
                    RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                    Peter,

                    I second Bill's advice. "Simplify your Application" is a great article, you'll find it at www.learn alpha.com. There are performance and integrity issues when working with data entry forms based on complex sets.

                    -- t

                    Comment


                      #11
                      RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                      Imagine you pin a form to the middle of the screen and restrict the ability of the user to close or otherwise navigate away from it to buttons whose effect you control.

                      A button might hide the current form and show another form in exactly the same place. The two forms could be based on different sets (not possible with two tabs on the same form) but the user wouldn't know this. They would just be seeing "different fields."

                      Take a yellow pad and use it to draw what you want the user to see. Only then should you create sets and screens. Remember that the linkages you understand will probably not be present in the user experience--nor ought they be.

                      Use paper to model the user experience and then create the necessary programming entities.

                      Reference:
                      Cooper, A., About face: the essentials of interface design.

                      Bill
                      Bill Hanigsberg

                      Comment


                        #12
                        RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                        Hello Peter,

                        First off, I can't recreate your problem. In briefly looking at your form and structure, I'm curious about the parentform.resynch() command on the onFetch event. What happens if you remove this command? I'm wondering if this command might be causing your issues. Without spending time on this, I would guess that this event fires no matter what level of record is fetched, parent, child, or grandchild. I'd be guessing if I went further with my thinking and guessing in this arena is paramount to having egg on face :-)

                        Does taking this command out change your behavior?

                        Jim

                        Comment


                          #13
                          RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                          I took it out in my brief testing but still operation was faulty as expected. For mine, you just can not develop a single form based on a complex set. My expereince is you can not even maintain data in a browse that involves just 2 tables in a one to one set without fields blanking out and other display/maintain issues - not to mention a set that has 2 x 3 levels with a mix of one to many and one to one. Are you suggesting it should be able to be done - I would like to see an example so I could learn from it.

                          Regards,
                          Scott

                          Comment


                            #14
                            RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                            Hello Scott,

                            ""Are you suggesting it should be able to be done""

                            Yes, to a certain extent. We all know that the browse object is getting a little long in the tooth and I look forward to the time it is replaced. But in my experience it isn't quite as fragle as it is being portrayed in this thread. One issue I have seen is when an order/filter is applied to the table displayed in the browse which is different from the set's linking definition. As far as having several browse objects and even multiple levels on a form, I have not had any major issues. I do try to keep everything as simple as possible, not for the sake of browses however, but for the sake of network traffic and general robustness. I have found that some browse display issues can be solved by simply slightly changing the height of the row, and or slightly resizing the browse width/height.

                            Personally the biggest issue I run into is getting the browse to refresh after I have manipulated data via xbasic, and to date I have always managed to get it to except in the rare situation where a different sort order has been applied.

                            Just my thoughts.

                            Jim

                            Comment


                              #15
                              RE: Erratic behavior of A5

                              All good thoughts. I have found that a browse can sometimes be refreshed more successfully if you give focus to an object outside the browse and then do a refresh.

                              If you happen to have a form based on a complex set with multiple browses etc I would love to see it so I can pull it apart and see how you get stability in to it.

                              Regards,
                              Scott

                              Comment

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