Alpha Software Mobile Development Tools:   Alpha Anywhere    |   Alpha TransForm subscribe to our YouTube Channel  Follow Us on LinkedIn  Follow Us on Twitter  Follow Us on Facebook

Announcement

Collapse

The Alpha Software Forum Participation Guidelines

The Alpha Software Forum is a free forum created for Alpha Software Developer Community to ask for help, exchange ideas, and share solutions. Alpha Software strives to create an environment where all members of the community can feel safe to participate. In order to ensure the Alpha Software Forum is a place where all feel welcome, forum participants are expected to behave as follows:
  • Be professional in your conduct
  • Be kind to others
  • Be constructive when giving feedback
  • Be open to new ideas and suggestions
  • Stay on topic


Be sure all comments and threads you post are respectful. Posts that contain any of the following content will be considered a violation of your agreement as a member of the Alpha Software Forum Community and will be moderated:
  • Spam.
  • Vulgar language.
  • Quotes from private conversations without permission, including pricing and other sales related discussions.
  • Personal attacks, insults, or subtle put-downs.
  • Harassment, bullying, threatening, mocking, shaming, or deriding anyone.
  • Sexist, racist, homophobic, transphobic, ableist, or otherwise discriminatory jokes and language.
  • Sexually explicit or violent material, links, or language.
  • Pirated, hacked, or copyright-infringing material.
  • Encouraging of others to engage in the above behaviors.


If a thread or post is found to contain any of the content outlined above, a moderator may choose to take one of the following actions:
  • Remove the Post or Thread - the content is removed from the forum.
  • Place the User in Moderation - all posts and new threads must be approved by a moderator before they are posted.
  • Temporarily Ban the User - user is banned from forum for a period of time.
  • Permanently Ban the User - user is permanently banned from the forum.


Moderators may also rename posts and threads if they are too generic or do not property reflect the content.

Moderators may move threads if they have been posted in the incorrect forum.

Threads/Posts questioning specific moderator decisions or actions (such as "why was a user banned?") are not allowed and will be removed.

The owners of Alpha Software Corporation (Forum Owner) reserve the right to remove, edit, move, or close any thread for any reason; or ban any forum member without notice, reason, or explanation.

Community members are encouraged to click the "Report Post" icon in the lower left of a given post if they feel the post is in violation of the rules. This will alert the Moderators to take a look.

Alpha Software Corporation may amend the guidelines from time to time and may also vary the procedures it sets out where appropriate in a particular case. Your agreement to comply with the guidelines will be deemed agreement to any changes to it.



Bonus TIPS for Successful Posting

Try a Search First
It is highly recommended that a Search be done on your topic before posting, as many questions have been answered in prior posts. As with any search engine, the shorter the search term, the more "hits" will be returned, but the more specific the search term is, the greater the relevance of those "hits". Searching for "table" might well return every message on the board while "tablesum" would greatly restrict the number of messages returned.

When you do post
First, make sure you are posting your question in the correct forum. For example, if you post an issue regarding Desktop applications on the Mobile & Browser Applications board , not only will your question not be seen by the appropriate audience, it may also be removed or relocated.

The more detail you provide about your problem or question, the more likely someone is to understand your request and be able to help. A sample database with a minimum of records (and its support files, zipped together) will make it much easier to diagnose issues with your application. Screen shots of error messages are especially helpful.

When explaining how to reproduce your problem, please be as detailed as possible. Describe every step, click-by-click and keypress-by-keypress. Otherwise when others try to duplicate your problem, they may do something slightly different and end up with different results.

A note about attachments
You may only attach one file to each message. Attachment file size is limited to 2MB. If you need to include several files, you may do so by zipping them into a single archive.

If you forgot to attach your files to your post, please do NOT create a new thread. Instead, reply to your original message and attach the file there.

When attaching screen shots, it is best to attach an image file (.BMP, .JPG, .GIF, .PNG, etc.) or a zip file of several images, as opposed to a Word document containing the screen shots. Because Word documents are prone to viruses, many message board users will not open your Word file, therefore limiting their ability to help you.

Similarly, if you are uploading a zipped archive, you should simply create a .ZIP file and not a self-extracting .EXE as many users will not run your EXE file.
See more
See less

Why Alpha4 runs SLOW under WIN2K and WINXP

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Why Alpha4 runs SLOW under WIN2K and WINXP

    There are a number of threads on this forum that basically revolve around the same question: "Why does A4 run so much slower on our new(er)/faster PCs running WIN2K/WINXP as compared to our older/slower machines running WINME/WIN98/WIN95?"

    The answer lies in the fact that A4 is a DOS application. Actually, for a given CPU speed, A4 will perform the fastest under MSDOS-5, MSDOS-6, or MSDOS-7. (It REALLY screams running on a new 3000mhz machine running MS-DOS!!)

    However, most of us want or need some of the functionality of Windows on the machines that we are running A4 on, and it is really getting more and more difficult to get MS-DOS to run on a "modern" machine. Modern disk drives and controllers and NIC cards aren't very compatible.

    Networking in generally is more of a pain under MSDOS (since most of us have forgot how to do it).

    Next best option is to run A4 on the fastest machine you can get WIN98 to run on. It is also very difficult to find drivers for a typical modern computer's video hardware and NIC. (It is possible to run WIN98 on a new Dell Dimension for example, but you have to disable the on-board video and NIC and install PCI video and NIC cards that still have WIN98 drivers available.) This is not a bad option if you can live with WIN98, as a lot of "current" windows programs will still run under WIN98, but this is also rapidly changing. (Example: Quickbooks 2006 will only run under WIN2K or WINXP)

    Starting with WIN95, the Windows operating systems run in Protected Mode (available starting with 286 processors). But DOS programs need to be run in Real Mode. So there were two choices: shut down Windows, reboot and run in MS-DOS mode (no Windows functionality), or run under Windows in what is sometimes referred to as Windows DOS mode. More appropriately this is called Virtual Real Mode, which runs Real Mode from inside Protected Mode, actually allowing multiple DOS applications to be run at the same time under the Windows OS, each of which think they are the only application running on the machine, and each having their own 1MB address space, with an image of the REAL BIOS interface. (Thus the reason you can run multiple occurences of A4 on the same machine at the same time under Windows.)

    Getting back to the original speed question, the reason that DOS applications like A4 run "fast" on a WIN98 machine is the way that WIN98 runs a DOS-based program. The code instructions are actually executed directly on the CPU! This is the reason it is possible to easily crash a PC via an errant DOS program running under WIN98/WINME/WIN95.

    Starting with WINNT, there is no longer DOS! WIN2K and WINXP are part of the WINNT family of operating systems. With this family of operating systems, when you open a "DOS" window and get the good old command prompt, you are actually running a Windows application that is a MS-DOS emulator (or simulator). So each and every CPU instruction gets decoded and acted on by the emulator program rather than being executed directly on the x86 CPU. Not much different than running a program that emulates DOS on a system with an entirely different CPU platform (like a MAC). The 10x speed degradation that Mike Konoff documented (when factoring in processor speed differences) in his comparison is fairly reasonable. It can take an emulator program 10 CPU instructions in order to emulate a single instruction executed directly on a CPU.

    Good for stability, bad for speed.

    To make matters worse, as a lot of people have noted, the DOS emulator supplied with WINXP seems to be even worse than the one supplied with WIN2K.

    So, what to do? (possibilities I have tried and am currently using in no particular order)

    1) Suffer with WIN2K/WINXP.

    2) "Upgrade" to a true Windows program like A5 (bad for those of us with a LOT invested in our A4 applications).

    3) Run under Windows98/ME/95 (not a bad compromise if you can get the drivers for your new PC's).

    4) Run true MS-DOS.

    5) A combination of all of the above (what we are doing here - AKA convoluted mess).

    All of the above have various pluses and minuses, and are based on my experience over the last 13 years starting with a rather small application and watching it grow into a monster while upgrading to the various versions of A4 (I think we originally started with Alpha-3), as well as operating systems, computer workstations, and server platforms.

    I hope this helps - good luck!

    #2
    Cliff and others,

    Some report no speed degradation at all. So if the emulator issue is correct, then everybody running A4V8 in WinXP should be reporting similiar speed degradations as I am. Why some and not others???

    I talked to a fellow A4 user yesterday at length. He has A4V4 running on a Win98 PC and A4V8 runnning on a WinXP PC. He barely notices any difference between the two. He DID say that he's running WinXP Service Pack 1.

    On my desktop XP machine, I'm running Windows XP Home Version 5.1, Build 2600, Service Pack - 2.

    My laptop is not here, so I can't tall you what I'm running on it, but it is WinXP Home.
    Thank you,
    Mike Konoff

    Comment


      #3
      I'm not sure whether this has any thing to do with your specific issues, but in both and old A4v3 application and A4v8, I make sure to exclude the table and index file types from antivirus scanning. We also make sure the workstations are not scanning network drives. (note: this is in a network server environment and not peer-to-peer)
      Dave

      Comment


        #4
        Hi Dave,

        Thanks for the idea. I'm heading in to work today. I'll check this one out, see what my setting are, change them if necessary, and report back.

        Thanks,
        Mike
        Thank you,
        Mike Konoff

        Comment


          #5
          Another option for running DOS applications on a newer computer is to take advantage of Virtual Machines. Microsoft has a product called Virtual PC that allows you to run another Operating System on a computer running Windows.
          You can run a DOS virtual machine on the same computer running Windows XP. I used this in an enviroment where we needed to use DOS apps that did not run on Windows XP.
          Andrew

          Comment

          Working...
          X