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Link that does not link..that is unless..

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    Link that does not link..that is unless..

    This is not a question but rather meant to save you a lot of headache if you come across this same problem and also an invitation for possible other suggestions.

    I am putting the final touches on a calendar program which I conceived many years ago and only got around to work on it this weekend.

    The application is meant to have all the features of any commercial calendar program and much much more, with the exceptions of what could not be done due to the limitations of alpha (BTW this one is big on my wish list: drag and drop)

    As such, this application is based on a set consisting of:

    parent 1-1 child1
    parent 1-1 child2 (alias child1)
    parent 1-M child3
    parent 1-M child4 (table with memo field)

    In the development process, I based the application on a leaner set that had:
    parent 1-M child (table with memo field)

    ..and all along, the memo field will show up when it is supposed to, that is, when it is not empty. To get fancier, I based it on the bigger set at which time the memo field refuses to show up, no matter what!!

    The link properties did not change.

    Can you figure out what is the culprit? I gotta have those other tables in the set, so iI can't eliminate them.

    #2
    Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

    Ever had a set, in which everything is done properly, then you design a form based on the set, you place a field from a child table on the form, yet the field remains blank and would not show any values no matter what?

    I never had that happened before!! up until now and only with a memo field. It seems that if anything is going to go wrong, is going to go wrong with a memo field.

    So, any ideas? any explanations? any solutions?

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

      Perhaps others will have more constructive ideas, but my only thought is that it's probably time for you to post an example that illustrates the behavior. Especially if you see the same thing using the default form for the set. -- tom

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

        Tom:
        I was able to duplicate the same error on a test table.
        Last edited by G Gabriel; 05-11-2007, 05:18 AM.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

          G, I'm not seeing it. What sequence do I follow to see the missing (empty) memo field?

          I noticed that the first child (Test table) has multiple records with the same link field value, but only some of them have memo field text. If this is the table that's not showing it's memo field values, perhaps your 1:1 link is connecting the wrong child table record...

          -- tom

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

            Tom:
            Go to the form "test2_set"

            This form is based on the set and it has a memo field from test4 (1-M link).
            In some of the records, this memo field (named "notes") has text. You could see that in the memo field in the embedded browse, but not in the memo field on the form: it does not show the text.

            I managed to resolve this problem, which I think is a bug, but neither the problem nor the solution make any sense with the exception that it works.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

              Open the default browse for the set to examine the composite records Alpha Five creates for your set structure. Navigate to the Pants_1 record, and you'll find a number of composite records with the same link field value. Most of them have an empty field value in the Note column. I think your form is displaying the wrong composite record. I was able to solve this by adding an embedded browse for the 1:N child table that contains the memo field.

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                Tom:
                I think your form is displaying the wrong composite record. I was able to solve this by adding an embedded browse for the 1:N child table that contains the memo field.
                Why is showing the wrong composite record ??! I am not sure if that is the problem, because if it is, then how come when you add the browse it allows the memo field to show it's content? Plus, I have no use for an extra browse on an already crowded form.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                  Gabriel,

                  I have experienced similar behaviour. I had the following:

                  parent 1-M child1
                  parent 1-M child2

                  Child1 had a standard embedded browse.
                  Child2 had a sort defined in the set definition and the Child2 fields were placed directly on the form. The aim was to just show the first record's data (the primary address). If Child1 had at least 1 record then the data would not show for child2. However if Child1 had no records then the Child2 data would show.

                  It seems that when you place a field on a form from a child table in a set based form and that child is based on a 1:1 link then the data shows with no problem. But if the child is based on a 1:Many link and there is no embeded browse then the data will not show consistantly. With an embeded browse you can choose a record and that record's data shows in the form placed fields. It seems like if the link is 1:1 then it is obvious to alpha which record to link to but if the link is 1:Many and there is no browse that alpha is not sure which record to display or more technically the pointer is not yet assigned or some thing. I guess if you/I/we only want to show one record from an otherwise one to many link we may need to change the link to 1:1 and use a complex key to get the record of interest.

                  These ramblings may be off the mark. But they are my observations and feeble attempt at a rationalization. :)
                  Tim Kiebert
                  Eagle Creek Citrus
                  A complex system that does not work is invariably found to have evolved from a simpler system that worked just fine.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                    Tim, your hypotheses square pretty well with my own observations here. It's as though Alpha Five expects the 1:N linked child table to be displayed through a browse object. Perhaps the designers assumed no one would want to use a 1:N link while also not permitting the user to navigate among the child table records. This expectation fits the typical design need just fine. However, in G's case and the situation you describe it does not. -- tom

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                      Tom,

                      Thanks for confirming that. If I was one of the designers I probably would have assumed the same. When I tried to do what I tried to do I wasn't really thinking of the consequences. I was trying a few different design approaches when I stumbled into this scenario. Rather than start a whole new set and form (which doesn't really take all that long) I was modifying an existing set and form. When I realised what was happening(or at least what I thought was happening) I filed that as part of the learning curve and took it as a sign that may be I should take a different approach. :) I can't elaborate on what that approach was because I haven't taken it yet. :)
                      Tim Kiebert
                      Eagle Creek Citrus
                      A complex system that does not work is invariably found to have evolved from a simpler system that worked just fine.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                        Tom & Tim:

                        Tim, you are not rambling. What you & Tom are saying make perfect sense, EXCEPT for one thing: how come it worked in the smaller set?

                        In anticipation that my design might not work, as I said earlier, I tried it on a smaller set. It worked fine with the memo showing values even though there is no embedded browse.

                        Feeling confident, I copied my work to the bigger set and went on programming and using the other tables in the set. But when I went to the view mode, to my dismay, the memo field is not showing anything!

                        I think I might have stumpled on a little oddity, one of those things that work for no obvious or logical reasons! Care to know how I fixed it? I do not wish to deprive you of the joy of finding on your own!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                          G, I hope you'll post your solution.

                          -- tom

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                            Tom:

                            Allright!

                            Go to the test set I attached.

                            The form based on the set has a memo field from test4 table.

                            In the set, test4 is the last link in the bottom:

                            move it up in place of test3.

                            That's all. Now the memo field will show the values!

                            IOW: the 1-M will act as 1-1 while it is still 1-M !!

                            There is a little bit of logic behind this, I think.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Link that does not link..that is unless..

                              Gabriel,
                              though it cetainly is satisfying to work things out for one's self sometimes I just like to be awed by someone elses genius. :D

                              This seems to follow in a way what I observed when there where no records in my Child1. If that was the case then the child2 data showed up.

                              ......some time passes by.....

                              Just tested in your initial sample (ie before you 'fixed it'. With test3 before test4)

                              1-In table test4 add some text to the memo in the first record(default order) that as 'p4' as item.
                              2-In test3 remove all records that have p4 as item.
                              3-Open form test2_set and advance through the parent records till you get to a 'p4' record. The memo appears.
                              4-In test3 add a record with p4 as an item and check the form. The memo no longer shows.
                              5-delete the record in test3 or change the item name and voila the memo is back.

                              Could you indulge us as to why you want to only see one memo out of a possible many that could be related.
                              Tim Kiebert
                              Eagle Creek Citrus
                              A complex system that does not work is invariably found to have evolved from a simpler system that worked just fine.

                              Comment

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