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Table design help needed...

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    #16
    Re: Table design help needed...

    Originally posted by Al Buchholz View Post
    Don

    I've seen some other products that do this job (when visiting my chiropractor) and I think you would be heading down the wrong road with the single record design.

    You've tackled a comprehensive system for a first time design and building exercise.

    Have you looked at other products to see what they do?
    Al,

    You're probably right about the single record design.

    I've had plenty of people (programmers) tell me I probably couldn't do this on my own. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

    The reason I decided to "play" around with this project is because there are no good programs out there (as far as I'm concerned) and I didn't have the resources to pay someone to do it (estimates over $100,000). Although I only plan on building the notes part of the program, at least for now.

    Comment


      #17
      Re: Table design help needed...

      Originally posted by DaveM View Post
      Don,

      Could you tell us what you are doing that requires the app to be built?

      Some cases require flat file and some require one to many or other.

      Give us a scenario, what you are building, maybe a scenarion of one or two fields and the possibilties for that field. We all seem to be reading your post differently.

      I like to sit down on paper and draw out what I need and then put it in a database form so I can figure out what I need to change. Was taught that way.

      The design of a database is the step that makes the rest anywhere from easy to impossible.

      Dave Mason
      Dave,
      If you haven't guessed already I am a chiropractor (who happens to like computers) that feels I can do a better job in developing a program than what is currently offered. I have a good friend who is a programmer (not on Alpha). We have worked for several months (part time & weekends) first developing the table structure and design and now I am working on the "meat and potatoes" of the notes part of the program. I think it is coming along very well. I do not want to develop a full practice management program on my own... but would hope to hire a full time Alpha programmer to help with this eventually.


      My first message had three attachments which I thought would be enogh to explain what I am trying to do. If not, I'll try to explain a sample scenario:

      While working on a patient I discover that the main complaint is the cervical region. I want to only perform a detailed exam on that part of the body. So I would not want to do a range of motion test of the lower back or shoulder etc. So I would choose that region do do my ROM exam in which I will input cervical flexio, cervical extension, cervical left lateral flexion, cervical right lateral flexion, cervical left rotation and cervical right rotation. I want those numbers stored to be able to retrieve in a report or even duplicate to another exam for a future date. I also want to be able to make calculations based on two exams to show change (hopefully improvement). Keep in mind that this is only one part of my exam. I will also be doing strength tests, orthopedic tests etc. for the same part of the body.

      I hope that make more sense. Thanks for reading.

      Don

      Comment


        #18
        Re: Table design help needed...

        Yes it does. I thought you were designing aircraft?

        You need on table for patient to keep it all in perspective. You then need a table on the(or more exams) with lookups.

        Your exam table could be connected in a set by patient number. The exam tables next main field should be a lookup for the region to be examined(you would have a table just for this) and each of the other fields could also have lookups for your range of motion, strength, etc as you need, but would key on the part of the body you chose with the first lookup for a direction for their own lookup. You can have a lookup on a table that only sees what you filter for.

        YOU CAN DO THIS!

        Now that it is clearer, it will be a bit of work, but very doable. You do need a set though so you can see 2 different exams in a report. You can break the body parts into different tables if you want to limit the fields to a certain number.


        FYI I had a set running over our lan where the master table had the max number of fields used. I had to break it into 2 tables due to new fields added. There was no difference in speed with 2 tables. The set just had one more table.

        Dave
        Dave Mason
        [email protected]
        Skype is dave.mason46

        Comment


          #19
          Re: Table design help needed...

          Dave,
          Thanks again for your help. I am sitting down now and putting it on paper. That does make it easier to conceptualize.

          If I understand correctly, I'll have a set that contains a patient table, an exam reference table, as well as many body part tables which contains the specific tests (rom, orthopedic, neurologic etc.) for that body region. That would replace the current structure I have now in which each table is based on the type of test (ie. all range of motion on one table) vs. each body part containing all the tests.

          Did I understand correctly?


          Don

          Comment


            #20
            Re: Table design help needed...

            Paul,
            This thread is Don's posting and it can get really confusing when someone elses issue/needs are inserted. I don't want to be rude, but it would be best if you began a new thread with your need/issue so it can be focused upon and it not confusingly intermingle with Don's deal. Thanks.
            Mike W
            __________________________
            "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

            Comment


              #21
              Re: Table design help needed...

              Don,
              Dave is correct, you can do this. Except I think your structure needs to be like this:

              PATIENT -1:many- BODYREGION - 1:many -EXAM

              Why? Having been a chiropractic patient, I am one person (Patient). I had several areas of my body that were attended to (many-regions) and these were attended to on many different exam visits (manY-Exam) where the exam yielded the results of the exam (flexion, extension). The exam would have a date, the exam type (rom, neuro,etc) and the historic exam actions (ex: flexion) which could be filtered by that type and action to show the exams over time. Or with some cool scripting building arrays for each motion, and using Xdialog, you could view several motions exam values over time.
              Mike W
              __________________________
              "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

              Comment


                #22
                Re: Table design help needed...

                Not to disagree with Dave or Mike, but I would suggest something like this:

                PATIENT -1:many- EXAM - 1:many - BODYREGION

                Because you each patient may have several exams, and you probably want to see the results of each particular exam. BUT also you may want:

                PATIENT -1:many- BODYREGION 1:1 Exam

                Because you probably want to look at the patient's body region results in one group (linked to the particular exam in order to put it into context.
                Peter
                AlphaBase Solutions, LLC

                [email protected]
                https://www.alphabasesolutions.com


                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: Table design help needed...

                  Don

                  It may (and usually) takes multiple sets to describe the relationships and how they should be used for a particular task.

                  The overhead caused by a new set is limited to a new index being created and maintained (unless it's already there for another purpose). The advantage is the flexiblilty of looking at the data efficiently from multiple viewpoints.

                  So one form may need one set, another form may need another set, and a report may need it's own set. It is better to have multiple efficient sets, then to have one set trying to be all things to all purposes...
                  Al Buchholz
                  Bookwood Systems, LTD
                  Weekly QReportBuilder Webinars Thursday 1 pm CST

                  Occam's Razor - KISS
                  Normalize till it hurts - De-normalize till it works.
                  Advice offered and questions asked in the spirit of learning how to fish is better than someone giving you a fish.
                  When we triage a problem it is much easier to read sample systems than to read a mind.
                  "Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler."
                  Albert Einstein

                  http://www.iadn.com/images/media/iadn_member.png

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: Table design help needed...

                    I think all three (Dave,Mike and Peter)are correct,

                    cause I think of the set design as being one 'layer' removed from the table structure ie the the number of and the purpose of the tables. As long as you get the tables to hold the data in the correct relation to the circumstances then you can create sets to your hearts content to view/manipulate the data as you see fit.

                    Edit: Basically what Al said except he said it better.
                    Tim Kiebert
                    Eagle Creek Citrus
                    A complex system that does not work is invariably found to have evolved from a simpler system that worked just fine.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Re: Table design help needed...

                      Thanks to everyone for their comments. I'm one step higher in a long staircase to the top.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: Table design help needed...

                        Don,
                        See if attached example might interest you. Good luck.
                        Mike W
                        __________________________
                        "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: Table design help needed...

                          Mike,
                          VERY COOL! THANK YOU! I will study this more thoroughly... I am sure it will save me many many hours.
                          Don

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: Table design help needed...

                            Don,
                            You are welcome. I started out with action scripting but slipped into Xbasic for MY expediency, and always for my education. Please don't hesitate to ask questions. I might know the answers...:D
                            Mike W
                            __________________________
                            "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: Table design help needed...

                              Don, I notice a fix is needed. I changed the button name (see pic) and that button needs the following at the TOP of the OnPush event script:
                              Code:
                              	'Get 'Value' property of 'Client_id' in Form 'F_Exams' .
                              	DIM GLOBAL vclientID AS c
                              	vclientID = parentform:Client_id.value
                              When I was building/testing this was established. If you go in and immediately press that button.... error because the variable was not yet dimmed.

                              Good luck
                              Mike W
                              __________________________
                              "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Re: Table design help needed...

                                Mike,
                                Thank again... by studying this example you have easily saved this "newbie" weeks of work. Not just the table and set design, but also some of the code and action scripting you have used in buttons. I am sure I'll have more questions as I dig further.

                                Don

                                Comment

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