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I need more speed!

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    #16
    Re: I need more speed!

    My host has been really working with me on this. He is suggesting moving me to another server with less "action." He mentioned something about the condition or congestion of the "node" as well. Beyond my understanding at the moment...
    Eric

    Alpha Five Websites
    longlivepuppies.com
    socialservicenetwork.com
    -------------------------------------------------
    socialservicenetwork.org

    Comment


      #17
      Re: I need more speed!

      Originally posted by EricN View Post
      My host has been really working with me on this. He is suggesting moving me to another server with less "action." He mentioned something about the condition or congestion of the "node" as well. Beyond my understanding at the moment...
      It sounds like you are on a VPS. If that is the case, the 2.4 GHZ Core 2 Quad CPU is shared across all virtual machines on that host. If the other VMs are busy, your VM will have to wait for access to the physical CPU and your site will run slowly.

      The fact that things run much faster on your development system and your comment about remote connection also point to this as being a likely cause of your problem.

      -Lenny

      Lenny Forziati
      Vice President, Internet Products and Technical Services
      Alpha Software Corporation

      Comment


        #18
        Re: I need more speed!

        Well, from Cleveland to there it went well:

        TraceRoute to 75.127.106.164
        Hop (ms) (ms) (ms) IP Address Host name
        1 13 6 7 72.249.0.65 -
        2 10 107 38 8.9.232.73 te-3-4.car1.dallas1.level3.net
        3 17 8 7 4.68.19.5 ae-13-69.car3.dallas1.level3.net
        4 68 7 8 4.68.63.194 -
        5 27 26 26 213.248.80.145 atl-bb1-link.telia.net
        6 197 222 200 213.248.91.14 globalnet-113073-atl-bb1.c.telia.net
        7 29 27 27 207.210.90.142 -
        8 29 30 31 207.210.114.178 -
        9 27 34 30 75.127.106.5 -
        10 33 27 28 75.127.106.164 -

        Trace complete

        What's the speed like when you FTP Up/Down ? Time the raw file movement to at least get a feel for what the CPU/Drives are up to. Filezilla will log the Que which is helpful for a quick diag.
        David Shaw
        Manager of Media Services and User Support
        Cleveland Museum of Art
        Cleveland, Ohio

        Comment


          #19
          Re: I need more speed!

          Horribly slow!

          I've also seen this happen with a bad or misconfigured router. Ask your hosting provider to simply swap out the router for a quick test.

          It would be interesting to put together a few basic HTML pages to see how they load.
          Bob Moore


          Comment


            #20
            Re: I need more speed!

            What hosting deal have you got? The upload speed from the server is what makes a big difference, a normal 8Mb broadband line usually has too low an upload speed to work for proper web hosting.

            Comment


              #21
              Re: I need more speed!

              I have Alpha Five Plus. Doesn't state what upload speed I have. This is shared, not dedicated. Didn't think I would need dedicated. I have sql databases that are significantly faster.
              Eric

              Alpha Five Websites
              longlivepuppies.com
              socialservicenetwork.com
              -------------------------------------------------
              socialservicenetwork.org

              Comment


                #22
                Re: I need more speed!

                If you want, you can try on my server. I think we did this once before? But let me know and I will give you upload settings, then wipe it off my server after your test. Mine is a dedicated server, 2GB RAM.
                Steve Wood
                See my profile on IADN

                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: I need more speed!

                  Thanks Steve. Yes we did do this a few months ago. If the offer still stands, please PM me.

                  More testing...
                  - I took my footer out.
                  - Created a blank test page.
                  - played with other pages, taking grids out and testing.

                  - Test page does seem to load fairly fast.
                  - Contact Us page loads fairly fast.
                  - Footer absence does not seem to make a difference. This is surprising since there is a good amount of code in it for "Who is Online."
                  - Taking grids out of pages that had 2-3 grids in them did not seem to make a significant difference.

                  A page that really loads slow, "JobsBrowseBoth" (Jobs/Resumes -> new posts in nav bar) contains 1 grid. This grid contains several calc fields, and a somewhat complicated filter. But I've seen grid calc field code posted in this forum by you gurus that was very complicated...

                  Wondering, if in this case, if just might be more efficient to display the JobsBrowseBoth fields as code instead of using a grid.
                  Last edited by EricN; 12-06-2008, 05:07 PM.
                  Eric

                  Alpha Five Websites
                  longlivepuppies.com
                  socialservicenetwork.com
                  -------------------------------------------------
                  socialservicenetwork.org

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: I need more speed!

                    Update
                    I was temporarily hosted on Steve Wood's dedicated server.

                    Big difference! I loaded pages hosted on my current host and the same pages on Steve's server at the same time. Pages, including those with three grids loaded at least 3X faster on Steve's server.

                    I noticed with my current host, code only pages and pages with dialogs did load fairly fast. But pages with only one grid or several grids took a very long time to load, even pages with very simple grids (no filters or calc fields) loaded very slow. Why?

                    In order to be satisfied with our applications, do we need to have (and pay for) dedicated servers as our hosts?

                    Thank you Steve for enabling me to conduct this test!
                    Last edited by EricN; 12-07-2008, 09:36 PM.
                    Eric

                    Alpha Five Websites
                    longlivepuppies.com
                    socialservicenetwork.com
                    -------------------------------------------------
                    socialservicenetwork.org

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Re: I need more speed!

                      Party at my server!

                      FYI, for comparison:

                      Dedicated server
                      Win2003 Server, standard edition, SP2
                      2GB Memory
                      3.2GHz Intel processor, dual core
                      Alpha server managed by AlwaysUp
                      Hosted at www.theplanet.com
                      T1 Internet speed, about 1.4MB up and download.
                      I pay about $170/month, so it's a lot more than a VPS.



                      Also Gary Traub recently, and others have mentioned that handcoding your grids makes them very fast. Hand coding means using xbasic to list records with the appropriate HTML to recreate the table, column headings, etc. You lose a lot of the grid's point-and-click features though.
                      Steve Wood
                      See my profile on IADN

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: I need more speed!

                        In order to try and improve the speed situation we will be hosting all new Alpha orders on "Alpha Customers Only" nodes. No other customers will be hosted on those nodes. These nodes will all be multi-core high RAM and will be our best VPS solution for Alpha customers.

                        That said, a VPS solution will NEVER match a dedicated solution. The key reason being that with a dedicated solution you are getting 100% of your uplink connection and 100% of access to the CPU. This provides consistent response. With VPS you are sharing the uplink and CPU access with others and your VPS can be slower when others are busy.

                        If response time is critical to the success of your application and to your business model, then a dedicated solution is the only way to go.
                        Affordable Alpha Five, PHP, MySQL Hosting.
                        Serving Webmasters since 2000.ZebraHost

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: I need more speed!

                          Originally posted by ZebraHost View Post
                          In order to try and improve the speed situation we will be hosting all new Alpha orders on "Alpha Customers Only" nodes. No other customers will be hosted on those nodes. These nodes will all be multi-core high RAM and will be our best VPS solution for Alpha customers.

                          That said, a VPS solution will NEVER match a dedicated solution. The key reason being that with a dedicated solution you are getting 100% of your uplink connection and 100% of access to the CPU. This provides consistent response. With VPS you are sharing the uplink and CPU access with others and your VPS can be slower when others are busy.

                          If response time is critical to the success of your application and to your business model, then a dedicated solution is the only way to go.
                          Completely agree although comparison with a much superior server has shown that CPU and other specs are far less important than uplink speed.

                          If someone has a business with a decent Internet connection (dedicated connection, guaranteed upload speed of 1Mbps+) it is cheaper to host your site locally than try and pay monthly to have it hosted elsewhere.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: I need more speed!

                            Originally posted by NoeticCC View Post
                            Completely agree although comparison with a much superior server has shown that CPU and other specs are far less important than uplink speed.

                            If someone has a business with a decent Internet connection (dedicated connection, guaranteed upload speed of 1Mbps+) it is cheaper to host your site locally than try and pay monthly to have it hosted elsewhere.
                            Our dedicated servers offer either 10mbps or 100mbps. Whilst it may be cheaper to host in-house there are (thankfully) many people who find that it makes good sense to host with a professional hosting company.
                            Affordable Alpha Five, PHP, MySQL Hosting.
                            Serving Webmasters since 2000.ZebraHost

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: I need more speed!

                              Originally posted by ZebraHost View Post
                              Our dedicated servers offer either 10mbps or 100mbps. Whilst it may be cheaper to host in-house there are (thankfully) many people who find that it makes good sense to host with a professional hosting company.
                              I definitely see the advantage for businesses that are making do with a download-oriented Internet connection - I was just pointing out that businesses that have a dedicated Internet line (for example if they deal with a lot of remote file transfers etc.) are better off hosting in-house.

                              We have a 1.5 mb up and download line which works great most of the time, but someone I know had a web server with specs far superior to ours but because they had a normal broadband line (up to 8 Mb download but that usually ended up being around 1 Mb at most and upload was around 0.2 Mb) it felt far more sluggish than ours. (Our server has just 1 Meg RAM and cost us a couple of hundred � including software)

                              It wasn't until they got a more powerful Internet connection with guaranteed 2Mb upload that they could start taking advantage of their powerful server.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Re: I need more speed!

                                Andrea,

                                I definitely agree that upload speed is a huge factor, but I am also impressed with the speed I obtain with just a basic setup:

                                I host my own server in house, WIndows XP Pro, Emachine!, 4 GB RAM, DSL with approx 3100 kbs download and just 332 kbs upload (as per speakeasy.net speed test).

                                With this setup, I get a failrly complex 15 line grid, with 23 columns, not editable, loading in approx 6 to 7 seconds, which is okay - with Xbasic, it loads in less than a second! And I get approx these times when accessing from my Iphone 3g: grid - approx 14 seconds/ Xbasic - approx 5 seconds. Not bad!

                                Gary
                                Gary S. Traub, Ph.D.

                                Comment

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