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Thread: Does it run on Windows 7?

  1. #1
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    Default Does it run on Windows 7?

    In the web page on the new features for Alpha v10 I read:
    The PDF Printer in V9 does not work on Windows 7
    Does this mean that any application I made will not work on Windows 7 with regards to the PDF functions included in V9?
    Will it give an error on startup?

    I did a search on the forum, but could only find some issues related but not exactly as the question here is.

    Can anybody confirm? Because when this is true I need to adapt my application requirements to exclude Windows 7.

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    I just upgraded my laptop from Vista to Windows 7 yesterday. My v9 programs work fine - except printing to the PDF. When I try to print a report to PDF I get 'Printer Not Activated - Error 20. I have upgraded this same application to v10 and everything works fine so far.

    HTH,

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Which means that V9 applications are not 100% compatible with Windows 7.

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Looks that way. I re-installed v9 from scratch and get the same results on 3 pcs. The same application in v10 runs fine on the same pcs. Of course v10 is using the new driver to print to PDF. It is v4. Hopefully Alpha will fix it.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Ted,

    Just curious here....hen you upgraded to Windows 7....did you upgrade to the 32bit version or the 64bit version.

    Regards,

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Good point Jeff....can see where you're going with this---the 64-bit Fix may apply....and now that I mentioned it a link would be nice even if it isn't the answer here (got a link Jeff?!!) :)
    Mike
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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Jeff,

    Upgraded all my pcs to 32 bit version. I wanted to see how it went with the installs so I did a clean full install on one pc from XP and did the upgrade on 2 others. All 3 went well, but all 32 bit.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hey Mike,

    Yep...that is what I was thinkin'. Here is the link just to tie all that back. My post #21 is summary of the 64 bit fix with the Amyuni 2.51 driver.

    http://msgboard.alphasoftware.com/al...ghlight=nul%3A


    Ted....as a work around (that would cost money if it worked). You can download the trial of the Amyuni Version 3 enduser product at the link below. The cost is $80.

    http://www.amyuni.com/en/enduser/pdf.../features.html


    If the trial worked by updating your Alpha Printer driver with the V3 driver(it says it is Windows 7 Compatible....looks like they don't have an enduser product for Version 4 which is Windows 7 certified) then you would be good to go...but there would be that additional cost.

    As a side note, I have a new laptop coming this morning that is Windows 7 64 bit. I will be installing Alpha V9 on it over the weekend. I will report back with my progress / status as I have no intention of moving to V10 at this point. Another thought, I had is to maybe run Windows 7 in the new "Windows XP Mode".....but I don't know anything about that at all....just read some snippets on the internet.


    Regards,

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    There I go assuming again.
    to maybe run Windows 7 in the new "Windows XP Mode"
    This being mentioned I assumed that this was tried as the obvious first choice to eliminate other possibilities....

    Ted, did you try the compatibility mode that Win7 has?

    In addition, what does the Amyuni forum/knowledgebase say about this issue...anything?
    Mike
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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Mike and Jeff,

    Thanks for the info. I am using Windows 7 Home Premium Edition. You need the Professional, Ultimate, or Enterprise editions to use the XP mode. Also, it is a separate download from Microsoft. Everyone I talk to says you are better off using VMWare or Sun's Virtual Box if you are going that route. I am going to setup a machine using Windows 7 Enterprise and Virtual Box. I downloaded Enterprise from my MSDN site this morning. I'll test it this weekend and report back with my results. Of course, you can use VMWare or Virtual Box with any version of Windows 7 so it really isn't a big deal. The built in 'XP Mode' just isn't available with Home Premium so you can't use Microsoft's 'XP Mode'.

    I have a couple users in the Dallas area who are getting ready to buy new Windows 7 laptops. That means either Professional and above or use virtualization for the XP mode, or upgrade to Alpha v10. Don't really want to have to do that for everyone.

    Ted

    Added Later for Info:

    Just to let you guys know. I have all versions of Windows 7 from MSDN. My production machine is XP. I plan on testing all versions of Windows 7 thoroughly on test machines. I will post my findings from all versions.

    Ted
    Last edited by TedBerry; 10-30-2009 at 11:36 AM. Reason: Added Info

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Ted,

    That's some good info right there...thanks for sharing.

    I'll report back as well how I make out with my V9 install. It will be on Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit. I know in Vista you could pay some bucks to Microsoft and get a new registration code that could upgrade your existing install on the fly. So, I might find myself doing that to get to Win7 Profressional if I have to. I have vmware on another machine....I guess I would go that route but I sure would like to figure out a way to do it natively in Win7. I might end up trying the newer Amyuni thing as well.

    Regards,

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Thanks Jeff,

    Here is a link from Microsoft.com comparing the various editions.

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/win...e/default.aspx

    You can click on 'XP Mode' about midway down on the left side for info on what is needed and how to use the 'XP Mode.'

    Have a good weekend. I am on my way to Oklahoma City for the weekend.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Ted,

    If I have been reading the MS sites correctly, XP mode is just a free copy of the XP OS that you load into Virtual PC. If you have W7 Home, then you can still download Virtual PC and load your own licensed copy of XP OS (maybe a copy that came with a computer which you scrapped).

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Point is, that if V9 applications are not 100 percent compatible with Windows 7, you need to upgrade your applications to V10.
    Next question would be, whether in that case V10 applications would be 100 percent compatible with previous Windows versions with regards to the Amyuni driver?

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Rob,

    I have read a couple articles about this and have looked at the Microsoft website also. From what I see, you have to have at least the Professional version to run virtual pc from Microsoft. Here is the link:

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/

    I don't think you can run this software if you only have the Home version installed. I am going to use Sun's Virtual Box. I have been using it in tests for awhile and it works fine for me and is free. You better have plenty of RAM though. I have 2 gb RAM dedicated for the virtual machines I setup with Virtual Box and then 2 gb for the host os.

    Bottom line is we have to use one of the solutionis mentioned in these posts to get around A5 v9 not printing to PDF on Windows 7.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Probably a dumb question but::

    If v10 has a newer version of the pdf driver, why not download a trial copy of v10, install the driver and see what happens with v9?? I am not sure what needs to be changed in v9 to use it, if anything.


    I do not have win7 or i would try to work it out.
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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Dave,

    Not a dumb question at all..

    I have v10 and did exactly what you suggest. v9 would not print with the new driver, unless I am missing something.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    I would suspect theat whatever file kicks the pdf driver from v9 would have to be replaced with the one from v10 if that is possible.


    The actual files are in a subfolder in v10 and in the main folder for v9 what if they were copied to the v9 main folder??? There may also be some registry work to do.

    You probbly tried that though.
    Last edited by DaveM; 10-30-2009 at 04:19 PM.
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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    The workaround I use is to print using File > Print to printer "doPDF".
    This produces a pdf file of your report.

    The driver can be found at http://download.cnet.com/doPDF-Free-...-10648880.html along with other choices.
    Windows 7 note: http://www.dopdf.com/forum/topic/ann...h-windows-7-rc

    Maybe I've missed the point(?), but this seems useable.

    Robin

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Ted,

    According to this page, you can run Virtual PC on any version of Win 7.

    http://blogs.msdn.com/virtual_pc_guy...-download.aspx

    If this problem doesn't get patched by Alpha, it will be impossible for developers to sell V9 applications.
    Last edited by aRob; 10-30-2009 at 05:39 PM. Reason: Additions

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Rob,

    That is interested because all the Microsoft sites say at least Professional. I decided not to go out of town this weekend so I am going to try it on a Windows 7 Home Premium pc and see what happens. I setup Windows XP using Sun's VirtualBox on a Windows 7 Enterprise pc this afternoon and it works well.

    You are right - it needs to be patched. I have several customers who have already either purchased new Windows 7 machines or have purchased upgrades.

    Have a good weekend.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Just following back up on my findings....

    My system is Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit....so your mileage may vary on 32 bit.

    I have acheived success by installing V9 and V10 trial. As expected...when just installing V9....no joy with saving as a pdf. Once I installed V10, then my V9 test using Alphasports was successful. After some different trials....here is what I came up with....

    After installing both versions...go into the printer properties for the V9 printer (Alpha Five Printer) and go to the ports tab. Select the NUL: port that is listed. This port was created by the V10 install and is similar the 64bit install directions in the link I posted in a previous post. You'll notice that the port description will say AlphaFivePrinterV4. This is the new Amyuni version Alpha is using and is 64bit and Windows 7 certified. In any case, I was now able to uninstall V10....but the driver has hung around it appears since it was in use by the Alpha Five Printer. I now have 2 Alpha Printers on my system however, the V9, "Alpha Five Printer" and the V10 "AlphaFivePrinterV4".

    Seems like a kludge but it is working for me. Additionally there is a Amyuni V4 directory in V10 that contains the normal "InstallAmyuniPrinters" executable that has been present in Alpha. There are additional DLL's in there now however. It may be possible to just use that on future installs without having to install V10....not sure.

    All in all, I sure hope Alpha does the right thing and steps up to the plate and makes at least one more patch for V9 and this should be part of that patch. I will enter this on the list Steve Wood has started for the items for V9 fixes that Alpha is going to "consider".

    Regards,

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    [QUOTE=aRob;513353]Ted,

    According to this page, you can run Virtual PC on any version of Win 7.

    http://blogs.msdn.com/virtual_pc_guy...-download.aspx
    QUOTE]

    Note that you cannot install Virtual PC 2007 if you (try to) install Windows Virtual PC first.

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Thanks for the info Sandy.


    But to get this thread back on track....

    If I might interject my thoughts on this....even though there has been some talk about running virtual machines and XP or Vista to get V9 to run....that isn't really a solution. There is NO WAY I could tell my customers who buy new machines to run a custom app I just wrote for them....

    "Hey we need to set up this virtual machine thingy inside of the shiny new pc you just bought and install windows XP on it so you can use the software you just paid me to write."

    The core issue is that V9 needs to be patched to run on Win 7.

    Regards,

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Jeff,

    You are right. I had already decided that today while doing testing. It hit me - what are you doing and why?

    A good friend of mine just happens to be the IT guy for one of my customers. I talked to him just to get his thoughts and he said the same thing. NO WAY would he do it.

    Alpha will fix it I think.

    Ted

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Jeff,

    What would be interesting to know is if installing the PDF Converter program directly from Amyuni whether you would get the same result. If that's the case, then it would be a $79 upgrade for v9 to work on Win7. Because if there is a further cost to Alpha to provide the upgraded drivers, I can't see them supplying them. Nor would I blame them either since v9 was released long before Win7. Or perhaps Alpha could get some deal from Amyuni to make a special offer to there customers.

    Or one could upgrade to v10.

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    I agree it would be highly appreciated if Alpha would patch the V9 version to work on Windows 7. But I would not keep my hopes up too high if I were you......

    It is a reason to upgrade to V10 no matter how you look at it.....

    So why take away a motivation for your customers to buy the new product, and invest time and effort in the proces to upgrade an old version? I personally do not see them doing that.....

    All together, I also think that the upgrade fee for shifting from the V9 to the V10 platform is rather high compared to buying a completely new product. Especially when you are forced too if you want to keep using the applications you already wrote on a new operating system from the Gates family. Upgrading is almost new price. That is not quite upgrading to me, more a small discount. I am slightly disappointed by that, although I do understand they have to earn a living. Point is, I have too.

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    MRichard,
    So why take away a motivation for your customers to buy the new product
    IMO, I would not like to have this as the attitude of Alpha.....wouldn't this cause Alpha not be motivated to even try to fix all the bugs as then that would drop the sales of the next version?? Not something that I would want to happen....but as this seems acceptable, I must be in a minority in thought regarding this. :)
    Mike
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  29. #29
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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    We are going to find out if Alpha cares about developers or if it's only interested in selling to end-users. A problem like this makes the 'Unlimited Distribution License' virtually useless. The economics of Alpha don't look so great when you have keep buying new RT licenses. Then there are the headaches from dealing with disgruntled customers. Upgrading to V10 sounds like a simple solution but what kinds of bugs are still lurking in this new version. I would rather use a new release for a while before giving it out to end-users. And upgrading a customer's system is not always an easy process.

    The simple fact is that developers need a stable, reliable product which is supported for more that 12 months. Can Alpha deliver such a product?

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    Default Re: Does it run on Windows 7?

    Hi Doug

    What would be interesting to know is if installing the PDF Converter program directly from Amyuni whether you would get the same result.
    I agree and thought about trying that but I got it working through the method I mentioned so I am gonna leave well enough alone I guess.

    If that's the case, then it would be a $79 upgrade for v9 to work on Win7.
    The problem is that the $79 is per seat it appears from the Amyuni site. So, the install I am getting ready to do would cost $1644 for a 20 seat license from Amyuni. I am just thankful my client has WinXP Machines. But, this will not be the case in the future with Win7 getting great reviews...the corporate world is likely to adopt it if those reviews continue and it will become an issue for anyone who has a legacy app written in V9. When my clients get a new machine a year from now....I don't think it is reasonable to say.....

    "ummmm...yeah...about that.....we need to redo your entire app in a new version even though the app has been working great for you....yeah it'll just cost you $1000 for the runtime and $5000 for me to convert the app and test it with the new version"......all because of the pdf driver

    Because if there is a further cost to Alpha to provide the upgraded drivers, I can't see them supplying them. Nor would I blame them either since v9 was released long before Win7.
    I can't really agree with you on this point. There are too many examples to list of companies that have upgraded (in a free patch) their software as the computing world changes. I don't think you can live in a vacuum if you are in business of making software such as Alpha.....just my opinion there however.


    But I would not keep my hopes up too high if I were you......
    I do not have my hopes high at all....if Alpha's past behavior is any indication V9 will never see another patch. I hope I am wrong however. :)

    It is a reason to upgrade to V10 no matter how you look at it.....

    The problem is that it is just not that simple to “just upgrade”. I hope Alpha recognizes that. I have been writing the app I am getting ready to install for a client for about 8 months. There is no telling what "behavioral changes" V10 would introduce into an app I have MANY hours writing and debugging.



    By Mike C.....IMO, I would not like to have this as the attitude of Alpha.....wouldn't this cause Alpha not be motivated to even try to fix all the bugs as then that would drop the sales of the next version?? Not something that I would want to happen....but as this seems acceptable, I must be in a minority in thought regarding this.
    You are not in the minority at all as far as I am concerned Mike. I am right there with ya'. The reason to get a new version of ANY software is for updated and new features....not to get bug fixes.

    In my little programming world, I fix all bugs for free for the life of the software I have written....even 8-10 years down the road. That is just how I run my business, now if the customer wants a new feature then that is a different story. I realize Alpha cannot do this, but I think just immediately relegating the prior version to an unsupported status is uncool....IMO....


    Regards,

    Jeff


    PS - I hope my post does not come across as being overly harsh. It is not meant to be.....these are just my observations. It is just my opinion that Alpha needs to take at least some role in supporting at least the prior version to a new release for X amount of time.

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