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Agast at the cost of the v10 University

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    #16
    Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

    Ken,

    Your course agenda is pretty tight. I would have to take half a day to discuss most of the subjects you assign 30 minutes to. There is that much to cover, plus 'training' always need real-life examples which add to the required time.
    Steve Wood
    See my profile on IADN

    Comment


      #17
      Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

      Originally posted by Steve Wood View Post
      Ken,

      Your course agenda is pretty tight. I would have to take half a day to discuss most of the subjects you assign 30 minutes to. There is that much to cover, plus 'training' always need real-life examples which add to the required time.
      All I did was put some time frames to their subjects. I would not want to pay for training only to have particular subjects lightly covered. At least with a time frame, one knows how much time would be spent in certain areas.

      kenn
      TYVM :) kenn

      Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

      Comment


        #18
        Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

        Oh, I see what you mean, giving structure to the agenda, not necessarily proper duration for subjects. OK.
        Steve Wood
        See my profile on IADN

        Comment


          #19
          Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

          Originally posted by Steve Wood View Post
          Oh, I see what you mean, giving structure to the agenda, not necessarily proper duration for subjects. OK.
          When viewed in this manner, I forces the trainer to provide adequate time for the subjects intended for instruction. Without a structure, too many will go away unhappy because what they came to hear was not adequately addressed.

          No matter the subject, many will have questions for their perticular needs. They have paid a lot of $$ and deserve an adequate, if not complete, answer.

          kenn
          TYVM :) kenn

          Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

          Comment


            #20
            Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

            If the seminar was recorded, and the seminar attendees got BOTH the attendance and a copy of the videos to take away... that would would be the both very beneficial and value priced. They could then sell the videos as a seminar series for those that did not attend, and the attendees a reference for what that might have missed in the blow through.
            Mike W
            __________________________
            "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

            Comment


              #21
              Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

              Originally posted by Mike Wilson View Post
              If the seminar was recorded, and the seminar attendees got BOTH the attendance and a copy of the videos to take away... that would would be the both very beneficial and value priced. They could then sell the videos as a seminar series for those that did not attend, and the attendees a reference for what that might have missed in the blow through.
              Sounds good but it's not going to happen. Why? The videos would cost too much. If not, those who paid a high price to attend would scream bloody murder!

              FWIW: It is not my intention to poo poo the training or Alpha. Quite the opposite. Alpha has come a long, long way not onliy in the product but in the documention. They give them high marks for what's been accomplished. From Selwyn, Richard and on down, they are a very dedicated and hard working staff!!!

              kenn
              TYVM :) kenn

              Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

              Comment


                #22
                Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                Sounds good but it's not going to happen. Why? The videos would cost too much. If not, those who paid a high price to attend would scream bloody murder!
                Not sure what you are meaning here Kenn. Are you saying the cost to Alpha for producing the video or the cost to those who are going to buy the video?

                I attend conferences all the time. I can tell you that a conference like this one would, by my estimate, by the very best, might be 20% absorbed. The value of a conference is in what you take away. Now days, videoing conferences is becoming a standard practice. Similar to webinars. If attendees took away (or received later) a copy of a video for reference and not just a syllabus, that would add a take away value that would make the costs (including travel, hotels and food) of attendance a more respectable value. In my field, conference videos is becoming more a standard with the cost of generating color syllabuses being what they are vs the cost of a couple of DVDs.
                Mike W
                __________________________
                "I rebel in at least small things to express to the world that I have not completely surrendered"

                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                  Originally posted by Mike Wilson View Post
                  Not sure what you are meaning here Kenn. Are you saying the cost to Alpha for producing the video or the cost to those who are going to buy the video?
                  The cost to the buyers.

                  Originally posted by Mike Wilson View Post
                  I attend conferences all the time. I can tell you that a conference like this one would, by my estimate, by the very best, might be 20% absorbed.
                  Alpha put a cancelation disclaimer in the promo so it looks to me like they have no plans of taking any kind of a hit. They are testing the water with the prices they set. Like anything else, the first time around is trial and error.

                  Originally posted by Mike Wilson View Post
                  The value of a conference is in what you take away. Now days, videoing conferences is becoming a standard practice. Similar to webinars. If attendees took away (or received later) a copy of a video for reference and not just a syllabus, that would add a take away value that would make the costs (including travel, hotels and food) of attendance a more respectable value.
                  Agreed

                  kenn
                  TYVM :) kenn

                  Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                    If Alpha is looking to jump start their developer community, perhaps they should make this course so ridiculously inexpensive that everyone will want to attend.

                    I used to attend a developer (and that's what this sounds like more and more to me) with 3 different tracks that you could subscribe to and it was attended by almost 400 people. The cost for the 4 days was around $ 500, so I took 4 people with me.

                    And the conference was video taped and the tapes were made available for download by the attendees a couple of weeks after the conference.

                    I think Alpha might be trying to turn this into a revenue generator when they should be using this as a way to promote the product.

                    At these prices, I can't afford to miss 5 days of work and I sure can't afford to take 4 more people with me.

                    I'm not saying that the material does not have value; in fact, I believe it is so valuable to the developer community (current and prospective) that Alpha should underwrite the cost to a higher extent and make it more affordable for the developer community.
                    John J. Fatte', CPA
                    PRO-WARE, LLC
                    Omaha, NE 68137

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                      Originally posted by jjfcpa View Post
                      If Alpha is looking to jump start their developer community, perhaps they should make this course so ridiculously inexpensive that everyone will want to attend.

                      I used to attend a developer (and that's what this sounds like more and more to me) with 3 different tracks that you could subscribe to and it was attended by almost 400 people. The cost for the 4 days was around $ 500, so I took 4 people with me.

                      And the conference was video taped and the tapes were made available for download by the attendees a couple of weeks after the conference.

                      I think Alpha might be trying to turn this into a revenue generator when they should be using this as a way to promote the product.

                      At these prices, I can't afford to miss 5 days of work and I sure can't afford to take 4 more people with me.

                      I'm not saying that the material does not have value; in fact, I believe it is so valuable to the developer community (current and prospective) that Alpha should underwrite the cost to a higher extent and make it more affordable for the developer community.
                      I don't think anyone could have said it any better! The high price LIMITS who will attend.

                      kenn
                      Last edited by forskare; 12-20-2009, 12:21 PM.
                      TYVM :) kenn

                      Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                        thanks for all the feedback - it is very useful and I think the points made so far are all well thought out and articulated.

                        1) we seriously considered doing this webinar style which would mean people could avoid travel and hotel costs, but after consulting with seasoned training folks and DR Heller, we decided to go with hands on because of the value of the hands on workshops that are part of the course

                        2) re the cost. We are not looking to turn this into a big profit center, but rather to help cover the costs of building the course material. It takes Dr Heller about 5 days of preparation to create course material for each day of teaching. So 5 days of teaching is 25 days of Dr Heller's time to prepare. Since he is a seasoned developer/trainer this does not come cheap.

                        3) the unknown is what does the supply/demand curve look like. ie would we sell 2x as many registrations at 1/2 the price?

                        We are are working to figure this all out.

                        Clearly Alpha Five v10 is a very rich and potent software product and developers will benefit greatly from good in depth training - so that is our primary mission in this Alpha Univ. excersize.

                        We will know more in a few days when the early bird expires on Dec 24.
                        Richard Rabins
                        Co Chairman
                        Alpha Software

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                          Hi Richard,

                          I appreciate you took the time to respond, Thank you!

                          Originally posted by Richard Rabins View Post
                          1) we seriously considered doing this webinar style which would mean people could avoid travel and hotel costs, but after consulting with seasoned training folks and DR Heller, we decided to go with hands on because of the value of the hands on workshops that are part of the course
                          The advantage of a webinar vs a lab setting depends on the manner in which the presentation is made. A lab can be done with a webinar as well but does not have the advantage of interacting with classmates.

                          Originally posted by Richard Rabins View Post
                          2) re the cost. We are not looking to turn this into a big profit center, but rather to help cover the costs of building the course material. It takes Dr Heller about 5 days of preparation to create course material for each day of teaching. So 5 days of teaching is 25 days of Dr Heller's time to prepare. Since he is a seasoned developer/trainer this does not come cheap.
                          Ahhh, The pressure is on Dr. Heller to deliver. If it's anything less than 8 or 9 out of 10, that may not be so good for Alpha

                          Originally posted by Richard Rabins View Post
                          3) the unknown is what does the supply/demand curve look like. ie would we sell 2x as many registrations at 1/2 the price?

                          We are are working to figure this all out.
                          1/2 the price? It's close to a no brainer.

                          kenn
                          Last edited by forskare; 12-21-2009, 10:01 PM.
                          TYVM :) kenn

                          Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                            Richard, if all the classes make, and you make good videos, then you could also offer them to the rest of the community at a reduced cost later, but still sufficient to recover the initial overhead, and a cache for the next one.
                            Cole Custom Programming - Terrell, Texas
                            972 524 8714
                            [email protected]

                            ____________________
                            "A young man who is not liberal has no heart, but an old man who is not conservative has no mind." GB Shaw

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                              Originally posted by martinwcole View Post
                              Richard, if all the classes make, and you make good videos, then you could also offer them to the rest of the community at a reduced cost later, but still sufficient to recover the initial overhead, and a cache for the next one.
                              Martin,

                              To the best of my professional knowledge, information and belief, in all of Alpha-dom history, they have NEVER been able to make a successful video of any seminar or conference. Even Ira Perlow was unable to do it when he had his conferences way back when (he tried). I think it requires a dedicated person(s) and a total commitment to make that happen. You would think it wouldn't be hard, but...???
                              Peter
                              AlphaBase Solutions, LLC

                              [email protected]
                              https://www.alphabasesolutions.com


                              Comment


                                #30
                                Re: Agast at the cost of the v10 University

                                Originally posted by martinwcole View Post
                                Richard, if all the classes make, and you make good videos, then you could also offer them to the rest of the community at a reduced cost later, but still sufficient to recover the initial overhead, and a cache for the next one.
                                Hi Martin,

                                I must be missing something. If you paid, for example, $1000 to attend the training and videos were made available to those who did not attend for $500, you would be a bit upset, would you not?.

                                kenn

                                Addition: The only way to do it is as Richard stated; either hold the training or a webinar. Pricint aside, it's the only fair way. Webinars are much easier to do than making videos. Videos require too much time to do it right and as Peter stated, it really involves a full time person working on the project.
                                Last edited by forskare; 12-22-2009, 11:25 AM.
                                TYVM :) kenn

                                Knowing what you can achieve will not become reality until you imagine and explore.

                                Comment

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