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Thread: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

  1. #1
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    CJ Singh
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    Default New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    We have now several new feature packs -File / Image upload download, Export to Excel, Action buttons, Reports etc etc but what is missing is a simple user management. Can there not be a feature pack for user management that is easy to implement ?

    CJ Singh
    Last edited by cjsingh; 09-23-2010 at 03:14 AM.

  2. #2
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Please define what would be in that feature pack.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Dear Steve,

    I am not a full time developer. I build my simple applications for data collection and find user management a pain. There is a lot of information available on the message board as well as a lot of documentation. But it is all fragmented and much too complicated for a non-full time developer.

    Present user and group management is at the developer level. The users / groups added must be published.

    What I am looking at is a user management from within the application developed. This management should include:

    1. Adding (by administrator or self registering) / Deleting / Editing users.
    2. Assigning what components / pages users are able to view / edit and what not.
    3. Filter data based on logged in user.

    I know above wish list is possible but requires knowledge of xbasic and is fragmented. If a one module / feature is made available where all this can be done from within the application created, people don't have to come back to developer for adding users. This would be a great feature which is presently lagging in Alpha 5.

    I was earlier using a software called PhpMaker which is a simple application but had an excellent built in user management. Though Alpha has security which is excellent but doing basic user management is a pain.

    Hope to see this in future.

    Regards

    CJ

  4. #4
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    The only thing from your list you cannot do 'online' is set what pages, components and other objects can allow view/edit by user group. The way Alpha is designed, that has to be set in the application while building it 'offline' in your project before publishing. After you have done that, you can set WHO has what access using online methods. The other items 1 and 2 are commonplace to handle online.

    Can you suggest a price range for such a utility?
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  5. #5
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Steve,
    Break out your double opt in user registration and management from your template and make it a stand alone. Include administrator components and pages. Set it up in a tabbed UI maybe.

    Have user registration components on pages that can be codelessly edited to register various groups. Set up a provision for a ulink to a corresponding user and group table in a dbf or sql database.

    Make it cheap and every new user will be your customer. I spent a lot of time on this and from the posts that pop up periodically so does a lot of Alpha beginners.
    Tks

  6. #6
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    This would be great!

  7. #7
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    I will finally do it. Its been a mainstay of all of my applications for three years, I've hardly altered that portion since inception other than keeping up with function changes in Security Framework and adding some convenience to how users are added/deleted from a grid.

    Just so others know, here is how it works:
    • Userlist is maintained automatically as users register online.
    • The double opt-in is the 'gold standard' how users should be registered, eliminates most bogus registrations and validates the users is registering themselves, not someone else.
    • Users start out PENDING when they register, and then are toggled to ACTIVE when they confirm the double opt-in. If they never confirm (many don't) then they are eventually removed from the user list. Also, if they are never toggled to ACTIVE then they NEVER were added to security framework. No need to clutter that system with people that have not completed registration.
    • The Admin can also manage all users online using a simple grid. You can search and filter the grid as needed. If you add or delete someone, they are added or deleted from Security Framework. Or you can add someone, but make them PENDING until they confirm, like normal double opt-in.
    • If you use the system, users always stay in sync between security framework and your local users table via the ULINK field.
    • There is a bunch more to it like bulk INVITE and how it lets you filter on who is logged in, etc. I'd have to decide how much to include since the full version is part of my Web Framework, a product I sell.
    • I should mention it does not follow the advice in the recent instructions from Alpha on how to maintain users in security framework as I think those instructions have flaws.

    Now, due to schedule, I cannot do this until October 8th, about a week away.
    Steve Wood
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    Member bob9145's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Look forward to it!
    Tks

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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Steve

    Keep us Posted


    Mark Moss

  10. #10
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Update - Finding it hard to separate user management out from my larger Web App Framework since is so integrated. Help me choose - I can create a mini-website just with security and user management, or I can just provide the components and A5W pages and some instructions, let you decide where you want to put everything.

    The problem with the first option is that then I need to include CSS and page formatting and menus -- and that will make it hard to integrate with your existing applications, plus I will have to charge more.

    The later would be less expensive but you would have to create your page layouts and insert the components where they need to go.
    Last edited by Steve Wood; 01-10-2013 at 05:57 AM.
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  11. #11
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Components with instructions would be great.
    Thanks for pulling this together.

  12. #12
    Member bob9145's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Components and on a basic page with instructions would work.

    Will you make it adaptable to multiple databases as far as tying in the corresponding ulink table?


    Tks

  13. #13
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    @Steve,

    Is it possible that you create a blank app with complete user management? We build our own app from there on. This shouldn't be difficult.

    Best regards

    CJ

  14. #14
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Hi Steve,

    Any update on this?

    Thanks!,
    Bill

  15. #15
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    OK, I just created a mini project from my Framework and stripped out everything not required for user registration and management. I will create a simple app to give it context. It will just be the Grids and database tables, and a few A5W pages*. Idea is you can slip it into your existing app. This process has served me well and I have processed thousands of users through this user registration and management system. It is secure with encrypted confirmation link, etc.

    *Item List:

    web_users table
    wt_users - grid to manage users
    wt_users_reg - dialog to allow users to register online
    regconfirm.a5w - page that processes users response to confirmation email
    wt_email - email templates to send confirmation email to user
    myaccount - grid to allow user to manage their own profile
    users_add - grid to add users by admin
    users_sec - grid to deal with security framework settings for user
    security framework configuration
    unauthorized.a5w - page where unauth users go
    login - dialog and page for logins
    logout.a5w - page to process loggoffs
    login_text.a5w - include page that shows LOGIN/SIGNUP

    security
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  16. #16
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Not sure if there is a popular interest, but I can also have these drop in components ready to go:

    - CAPTCHA for A5 - example: www.ialpha5.com/framework_v3/contact.a5w
    - License Registration Server for A5 web apps - require licensing for your A5 web apps.
    - Dynamic Tab Groups for Linked Content areas. Dynamically set what tabs show depending on any criteria. Eg. show TabGroup1 for Admins, TabGroup2 for Staff.
    Last edited by Steve Wood; 01-10-2013 at 05:56 AM.
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  17. #17
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    All that sounds like something I can really make my Alpha experience more enjoyable.!

  18. #18
    Volunteer Moderator Steve Wood's Avatar
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    Default Re: New Feature Packs - Why not user management feature pack?

    Sign up at www.alphatogo.com or www.alphadevnet.com to see how the user registration portion works.
    Steve Wood
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