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Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

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    Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

    A small database backed up to �A� drive on a single disk backs up and restores ok.

    Looking at the disk dir. It shows the "database name.ZIP"

    A larger database � say three or four floppy disks � prompts for the disks as expected and finally comes up with backup complete etc everything looks good.


    The problem arises when trying to restore � insert disk one - click one of the restore options � Drive A:\ is shown ok in the restore box, but no file/database name is shown, and the restore button is "greyed out".

    Looking at the disk Dir. It shows the database name, BUT with a .DAT extension.

    Backup to Zip or hard drive is fine, but it suits in this case to use floppies.

    Any thoughts appreciated


    Brian

    #2
    RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

    Haven't tried backup to disk myself - and this may be all too obvious - but did you try starting with LAST disk of series?

    Comment


      #3
      RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

      Yes, I tried all four disks.

      all the Dir. show "database.DAT" and restore remains greyed out.

      Brian

      Comment


        #4
        RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

        This probably doesn't solve your problem, but backing up to floppy is probably the worst recovery scheme imaginable. Floppy disks are completely unreliable. In some ways, it would almost be worse than not backing up at all, since you think you have a backup, but don't. Moisture, dust, scratches, and age all will corrupt a floppy. I would suggest picking up a CD-R drive, a zip drive, an extra hard drive...anything.
        Aaron Brown
        Alpha Software Development Team

        Comment


          #5
          RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

          We checked this out and have found there is a bug when attempting to restore from a backup on multiple floppies. We will fix the bug and release it in the next patch.

          However, I would still recommend that you reevaluate your backup scheme and not backup to floppy disk.
          Aaron Brown
          Alpha Software Development Team

          Comment


            #6
            RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

            Aaron

            Appreciate your comments.

            Certainly I also recommend the more reliable methods of backup and storage. Floppies make me shudder, but some of my customers are still using hardware that would be worth less than the cost of a Zip 100, and they are not prepared to change the "old ways" of doing things.

            I frequently visit Companies (not my customers) who as a matter of course back-up vital data onto 10 standard floppies. Hi-tech is still an alien concept here-abouts.

            Thanks,
            and I will look uot for the patch

            Brian

            Comment


              #7
              RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

              Floppies are definitely not the way to go for backups. Personally I don't think CD's are either for important data. I do use CD's to back up to but have had them beckup with no errors and then be unreadable on restore. IMHO the best backup is still tape. It's slower but if the error report says you have a good backup, you have a good backup- plus the capacity on even the cheap Travan drives is so much better. Now up to 40 gig.

              my $.02

              Russ

              Comment


                #8
                RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                While I agree Aaron that using floppies is not the best way to do backups, I disagree that CR-R is any better. I base this on tons of experience with both, and if one were to stick to high quality floppies, I think that would be at least as good as CD-R. I don't have enough experience with zip drives to comment on those. High quality (expensive) tape systems may be great, but lower cost, lower quality tape systems are not nearly as reliable in my expereience as some seem to assume. The best in my experience is backing up to a separate hard drive. Often you can just do that on one of the workstations. Taking the hard drive backup offsite can be a negative, but if that is needed (it should be needed!) for not much money you can set up any hard drive to be hot pluggable and removable, or there are fairly inexpensive USB or firewire, semi portable drives that could be used.

                My 2 cents.

                Ray

                Comment


                  #9
                  RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                  I don't believe any single backup method is fool-proof. The likelihood of two near-simultaneous hard drive crashes is low but not impossible. Surely a lot of backup failures are a result of poor handling of the backup media - resulting in dust, temperature changes, bumps, scratches, etc. I wonder if backup (and handling) procedures may be at least as important as the method used.

                  I am surprised to see the assertion that "high quality floppies" may be "at least as good as CD-R". While some of the early burners, burner software and cheap disks were prone to creating lots of coasters, it's been my experience that modern CD-R creation is near flawless.

                  What sort of problems have others had with CD-R backup?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                    Well, my experience has been with Plextor drives, which are considered by many to be as good as you can buy. I have also only used high quality CD media. Now, I must admit that I was not talking about CD-R and should have made that clear. My experience has been with CD-RW where the disks are reused at least 20 times. Examples of problems: When backup is scheduled to be unattended (in the middle of the night), too many times the backup fails because no disk was found in the drive. Of course there could be many reasons for this. Another problem with CD media in general is that unless great care is taken with it, it can become so scratched up and/or dirty that you get read or write errors.

                    Of course, what we are talking about here is a comparison. Cheap floppies are certainly not very reliable. But good ones have been pretty darn good in my experience. But don't get me wrong. I am not suggesting that floppies are the backup media of choice. What I am saying is that I have not had good experience with CD-RW as an alternative, at least in an unattended backup environment.

                    Ray

                    Comment


                      #11
                      RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                      I have a genealogy database file on a 3 1/2 floppy using Alpha Five Version 0. I now have Alpha Five Version 5 installed on the computer and I am unable to import the old backup file into the new version. How can this be done Thanks W Hopkinson

                      Comment


                        #12
                        RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                        Floppies fail over time. It will happen. A verified CD-R in a case will not fail over time...once burned, they stay that way. If they are getting scratched up, they are not getting taken care of properly. A tape or hard drive that is not handled properly will also fail. I wasn't suggesting that a CD-R is an ideal backup medium, just that it is better than a floppy. Most people already have a CD-R drive, so the investment is minimal.

                        My only point was that floppy disks are useless as a backup medium and in my opinion they are worse than no backup at all. When one thinks they have a backup, they are less careful with data....then they suddenly realize the harsh reality that a backup has failed or doesn't exist.

                        Regardless, you can buy a fairly inexpensive DDT drive for just a little more than a CD-R drive. Tapes are a bit expensive, but with a good rotation schedule, you can do with very few. You don't need a $25k 15-slot automated drive that uses 72 GB DLT tapes to backup an A5 database, but a small initial investment will save time and money when the inevitable happens.
                        Aaron Brown
                        Alpha Software Development Team

                        Comment


                          #13
                          RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                          We don't really disagree (much). But, "If they are getting scratched up, they are not getting taken care of properly" is exactly one of my main points: In my experience the people handling these backup discs do not take care of them properly, no matter how many times they are instructed in the proper care of the discs.

                          In my case, they were supposed to be rotating CD-RW discs daily and taking last night's off site each day. But it did not take long before the discs were either scratched or so dirty (it seems with finger print smudges of one kind or another) that problems arose such that unattended backups or restores were failing with intolerable frequency. But again, this was CD-RW and maybe if one used a new CD-R each day, kept it a week or a month and then threw it away, maybe it would be a better story. All I'm telling you is that this experience was no worse than my days of using floppies many years ago. But no, I would never recommend floppies for significant backup purposes today. But except possibly for personal use (where you are the one doing everything) I would also not recommend using CD-RW in a reusing of discs backup scheme.

                          Ray

                          Comment


                            #14
                            RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                            I presume you mean Alpha Five version 1. I don't recall v1 having a backup feature. So then the question is, does the file (or one of the files) on the floppy have a dbf extension? If it does and that file does not open in (or import) into version 5, the file is probably corrupt. Try running scandisk on the disk. In the DOS days there used to be some even better floppy repair programs around but I don't know of any today. Can the file be copied from the floppy to your hard drive? That might help.

                            If the file is in some backup format, then you need a program that can handle whatever the format is. If it is a compressed zip file (usually with a zip extension), you need to unzip it.

                            Ray

                            Comment


                              #15
                              RE: Backup to multi-floppies � restore failure

                              one of those old utilities that is still around is Spinrite from Gibson Research Corporation. I don't use it often, and it doesn't always work, but it has worked when nothing else would.

                              www.grc.com

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